Hello!

I read your blog post about numbered family name traditions and wanted to write in. Our current finalist name is George Taylor, which is also the name of my husband’s grandfather and great-grandfather. In our case, we would be restarting the tradition vs. naming directly for the father/grandfather of the baby. George is also a family name on my side, and I like the rhyme of Taylor in the middle. However, now that we’re in the third trimester (baby is due in a little over a month!), we’re waffling about this choice and really not completely certain that it’s the right direction for us.

Our girl name for this baby was going to be Audrey Joyce. Audrey because we like the sound of it and the meaning of “noble strength”, and Joyce for my godmother. We had a couple other contenders: Florence or Flora, Diana, Aurelia; but once we put Audrey Joyce together it simply felt “Just Right” in the same way that Mae Beatrix felt right for our first child. (Mae is my mother’s middle name and my husband’s grandmother’s name; Beatrix we like the sound and meaning, although we definitely waffled over Beatrix/Beatrice and only decided as we were filling in the paperwork).

The other boy’s name that is currently a top contender: Oscar Reid. Oscar we just like, Reid honours a paternal relative. I also love Samuel, Lawrence, or Paul, and my husband likes Hawk, Peter or Wyatt. When we go through lists of names, it feels like we both have strong feelings in opposite directions and can’t easily find a middle ground.

I worry that I’m getting sucked into George Taylor Fulford (the fifth, because there is also a great uncle and a distant cousin sharing the name!) because I’m tired of trying to find a name that we both like, that also works in French (we are currently living in a majority French-speaking area, and I don’t want to complicate things for our little boy), that also suits our tastes. Clearly this name works, it’s worked four times before.

Is that reason enough to pick a name? I’m a little sad it doesn’t feel as ~magical~ as our girl name picks, are we just defaulting to what is easiest?

Thank you!

You’ve read the other post, so we don’t need to start with WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DO THIS, WHY WOULD ANYONE WANT TO DO THIS, WHY IS THIS A THING THAT KEEPS HAPPENING. We can skip ahead.

Here is what I suggest: name him George, because it is a family name on both sides, and because it works in your area, and because it’s great with Mae and with a possible future sister Audrey, and because it is on Swistle’s own list of boy names that got away. But give him a different middle name and don’t make him a V.

See if you can find a middle name that gives you that click you got with Mae Beatrix and Audrey Joyce. George Reid Fulford? George Oscar Fulford? I’d prefer a middle name from your side of the family, though, or from your own favorites list, since the child will already have a surname from his father’s side, as well as a first name in heavy use on his father’s side. George Samuel Fulford, George Lawrence Fulford, George family-name-from-your-side Fulford, George your-family-surname Fulford.

I also think Oscar Reid is a great choice—though, again, I’d prefer the balance of including a name from your side of the family, rather than two from the father’s side and none from yours.

Hi Swistle!

I love your blog and have been a reader for years! Our first child (a boy) is due in 4 short weeks and we thought we had the name figured out but now are second guessing. My husband is a junior but goes by a nickname (and never his legal first name). If we were to continue the naming tradition and name him as a third we would only call him Tripp and never his legal first name. We started to doubt if Tripp is a name that would be setting him up for success one day? Is Tripp a successful doctor, lawyer, insert professional job here? We also worry if he will feel like he has his own identity if he’s a third. Perhaps we are just getting cold feet as the date gets closer or maybe these are valid concerns? I’d love your thoughts.

Other names we like but aren’t sold on are Reid (husband feeling luke warm on this one), Charlie (husband loves more than I do – I feel like it’s too common), and Emmett. Other names we like but don’t feel like the one/one of us likes but the other doesn’t as much are Lane, Grey, Walker, Lee, Harrison, Cooper. If you have any other suggestions I’d love to hear them!

Thank you!!

I think Tripp would work fine for a doctor, lawyer, etc.; it’s a nickname that smacks of patriarchal naming traditions, which in our society can further smack of wealth, higher education, and success. It sounds like prep school, and summers spent wearing all white on a boat or a tennis court; it also sounds friendly and approachable: the smiling boy with good eye contact and very white straight teeth and a good haircut and an even tan. Tripp, Skip, Chip—they’re absolutely DESTINED to be lawyers and politicians. And if he does grow up and feel like it’s not the name for him, he has the ability to change it: he can choose to go by his given name, or by his middle name, or by another nickname.

But here’s the question I have started asking myself about Sr./Jr./III/etc. naming traditions, and the question is only getting stronger and louder over the years: Why?

That can’t help but sound rhetorical and combative, but I also mean it literally and actually: What is the reason any of us WISH TO DO IT? Where does the positive warm feeling come from, when we choose a name the child won’t use, and we decide to choose it over all other possible names? What is the part we like about naming a child for his father, when it’s a name his father doesn’t use either?

What is the POINT of this tradition? No, no: don’t hear the rhetorical and combative version of the question, hear the ACTUAL question: What is the POINT. Of this tradition. What is the WHY of this tradition? What do any of us WANT FROM this tradition? What is the BENEFIT, what is the GOOD, what is the APPEAL, what is the part we LIKE? IS there a benefit? IS there something good? IS there an appeal? DO we like it?

We have had women get huffy over this question in the comments section: “Well, I LOVE my husband and WANT to honor him!!” Good, good! Is your daughter also named after you, and are you also named after your mother, including birth surname, and is your husband (who has taken your surname, because tradition is so important and he doesn’t want to have a different surname than his children) getting huffy on someone else’s name blog saying “Well, I LOVE my wife and WANT to honor her!!” Or is giving up naming rights to the husband’s family something we ask almost exclusively of women, framing it as an unreciprocated way for them to show love and honor to men?

And yes, we HAVE heard of some families that DO have matriarchal naming traditions! Those are so fun to hear about BECAUSE THEY ARE SO EXTREMELY RARE! I have never met a woman who was a Sr. or a Jr. or a III, but I have met many, many, MANY, MANY, MANY, MANY men who were Sr./Jr./III and even IV/V/etc. May this equalize in the future, one way or another. If you were to tell me that you planned to have more children, and that of course the two of you also planned to name your first daughter entirely after yourself and make her a Jr., including giving her your birth surname which you had also retained, I would feel VERY DIFFERENTLY about this plan to name your first son entirely after your husband and his father.

This little rant isn’t against honor names in general: I am VERY KEEN on honor names. But I am opposed to what happens when an unequal tradition gets so absorbed into society that we don’t question it or notice how unequal it is anymore. It IS WEIRD to have something that’s considered very normal to do with father’s/men’s names, but not with mother’s/women’s names. It IS WEIRD to allow one parent’s side of the family to have naming rights that interfere with one or both parents’ preferences. It IS WORTH EVALUATING what benefit we are getting when we give a child a name they won’t be using, and whether that benefit is actually worth something to us or whether we’re so steeped in the tradition that we just feel it somehow SHOULD be worth something to us. It is WORTH EVALUATING whether we are giving our child something we think they will WANT, or if we are just passing down another generation’s worth of burden and obligation.

Do you WANT to give him this name? Do you both love it, and do you both actively want to use it? Or are you feeling pressured to use it so that you won’t break the tradition? If you are feeling pressured, I encourage you to reflect on the exponential increase of that pressure with each generation; I encourage you to spare the future generations while the pressure is still relatively low. If future generations are not pleased to be spared, they are 100% free to start it up again: they can even legitimately use the suffix III! But I think it is worth noticing how few people DO restart a broken tradition. My guess is that the feeling is nearly always INTENSE RELIEF that the tradition was broken before it was their turn to make the decision to keep it or break it.

If you wish to break the tradition more gently, give your son one of your husband’s names as a middle name, and/or an honor name from your side of the family if your son will already have your husband’s surname. Perhaps the same initials as your husband’s name, but with different honor names from your side of the family; or perhaps variants of your husband’s names in swapped order (Michael David becomes Davis Micah, for example). This communicates that you DO want to honor family, but perhaps not to honor the same person over and over and over again, generation after generation without ceasing.

…Where were we? Yes, if you decide to name your child after your husband and your husband’s father, I think Tripp or Trice or Trey will make a perfectly acceptable nickname, and that the child will not find it gets in the way of his success.

We can’t answer the question of whether he will feel as if he has his own identity; it depends on how much of his identity comes from his name. Presumably he will feel as if he has his own identity, but not as if he has his own name. Perhaps like some of the other men I have known, he will get extremely focused on his little suffix, and will get clutchy and possessive about it because it will be the part of his name that will feel like HIS.

I love Emmett and Reid from your list. We had Charlie on our finalist list for Henry. I wonder if you’d like Reeve or Rhys.

Reid and Charlie makes me think of Rory and Riley.

Emmett makes me think of Everett and Elliot. Grey and Reid make me think of Grant. Lee reminds me of Leo which makes me think of Milo which makes me think of Miles which makes me think of Nolan which makes me think of Simon.

Harrison makes me think of Harris and Davis, which along with Lee make me think of Louis, which makes me think of Wesley, which along with Walker and Cooper makes me think of Wilson and Warren.

I’m reluctant to think of any more options, because now I am eager to get my hands on your family tree and go hunting for candidates. Perhaps your own family surname, if that has been supplanted by your husband’s family surname? Perhaps a family surname from an earlier generation? Perhaps one of your father’s names, so that there is one name from each grandfather, which makes a bit of a point about how difficult it is to argue that the child should instead have been named for only one grandfather?

Hi Swistle!

You and your readers helped us name our son in 2017 {Baby Boy Sepas – Brother to Evelyn}.

After 3 years of fertility struggles, 2 miscarriages, and 5 failed rounds of fertility treatments, I am due this Fall with the sweetest surprise! I find it odd that I’ve been trying for 3 years for this babe, yet am struggling so much to find a name for him or her! We are not finding out the gender.

My name is Bridgett, my husband is Evan, and we have two children – Evelyn Claire and Luke Thomas. Our last name is Sepas with a silent T in the front, pronounced See-pas.

I am finding that I am drawn to surnames as first names this time. In my mind, I have decided on a name if it’s a boy – Baker Lawrence. Lawrence was my beloved Grandpa’s name. I just can’t fully commit because I don’t know if it goes with the sibling names, and it’s definitely more unique than the sibling names. Other names we like are Reid, Baylor, Wade, and Rowan. Rowan is still my favorite name (it was my favorite when my son was born 5 years ago as well), but we have since had a close family member use a very similar name, so I don’t know that I want to use it now. I also love other surnames like Hayes, Brooks, or Davis, but don’t like the ending “s” with the starting “s” of our last name.

My real struggle comes with names for a girl. I am drawn to surnames for a girl too, but so many that I like also end in “s” – Ellis, Collins, Hollis – and it just doesn’t flow with the last name. Our short list includes Harper, Emelia, and Hallie. We will use Wren as a middle name for a girl – taken from the middle of Lawrence – to still honor my Grandpa. Any other girl suggestions that are in my style? Or maybe this style doesn’t go at all with the siblings and I need to figure out my actual style?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you for considering!

Something I think you’ve got going for you here is that Evelyn and Luke are already adjacent/compatible styles rather than a matched style. This gives you more room to add a third adjacent style, without it being as surprising a style shift as it would be if you had two of the same style and then changed course.

Baker is quite a different style from Luke; the matched K-sound helps to bring them a little closer together, I think, but you’re right that it’s a bit of a jump, and Baker Sepas feels a little awkward. But I further think that by the time parents get to the third child, no one can blame them for branching out a little. And since Luke was a family name, that gives an easy explanation for why you might change styles. Not that you have to explain yourself. I’m just working through it for you the way I have to work through it for myself: i.e., imagining I have been called before The Naming Board and must justify my decision.

My own vote from the boy name list is Reid. Evelyn, Luke, and Reid.

For a girl name, I think the style shift is more readily accommodated because the name Evelyn used to be a prep-school boy name. Sure, NOW it’s used almost exclusively for girls and doesn’t feel particularly preppy—but our multigenerational hive mind can still tap into that old feeling where Ashley and Evelyn were chums at their all-male boarding school. Here are some surname names (or surname-sounding names) I think might work in the sibling group and with the surname:

Ainsley; Ainsley Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Ainsley
Aubrey; Aubrey Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Aubrey
Brennan; Brennan Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Brennan
Darby; Darby Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Darby
Darcy; Darcy Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Darcy
Delaney; Delaney Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Delaney
Hadley; Hadley Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Hadley (similar in sound to Hallie)
Hillary; Hillary Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Hillary (I know it’s too soon but it’s so perfect)
Holland; Holland Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Holland (similar to Hollis but no -s)
Kerrigan; Kerrigan Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Kerrigan
Lane; Lane Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Lane (maybe too much)
Leighton; Leighton Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Leighton
Linden; Linden Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Linden (maybe too much)
Mallory; Mallory Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Mallory
Meredith; Meredith Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Meredith
Merritt; Merritt Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Merritt
Sloane; Sloane Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Sloane
Winslow; Winslow Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Winslow

I wanted to suggest Ellison (Ellis but doesn’t end in -s!) but it seems too close to Evelyn.

Or I am interested in your willingness to change Lawrence to Wren to honor your grandfather, and I wonder if Florence (Lawrence-with-an-F) would also feel like an honor name? If so, this sibling set makes me want to faint with love: Evelyn, Luke, and Florence. Granted, Florence Sepas requires some effort to say, and I agree it’s not ideal—but FLORENCE.

Or of course there is the name Lauren, which is even more obvious a connection. Lauren Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Lauren. I remember there was a fairly famous (that is, I know about it despite not watching soap operas) “Luke and Laura” plot on a soap opera in the 1980s, and it went on for years; I don’t know if that’s something that needs to interfere with names for this current generation of babies, but it’s nice to consider such things ahead of time rather than afterward. Lauren could still work as a middle name.

Or I think Lawrence makes a nice middle name for a girl, if Wren doesn’t end up working with the first name you like best. It’s so close to Lauren and Florence, and the current generation of boys doesn’t seem to be using it much.

More options that came to mind even though they’re nothing like what you said you were looking for:

Claire; Claire Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Claire
Claudia; Claudia Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Claudia
Fiona; Fiona Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Fiona
Harriet; Harriet Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Harriet
Hazel; Hazel Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Hazel (similar in sound to Hayes)
Lydia; Lydia Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Lydia
Margo; Margo Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Margo
Pearl; Pearl Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Pearl
Polly; Polly Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Polly
Rosemary; Rosemary Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Rosemary
Veronica; Veronica Sepas; Evelyn, Luke, and Veronica

My partner and I can’t agree on any names for our identical twin boys due in early October.

Last name is Boulerice.

We have 1 son who’s named Declan John Robert.

He likes scottish / Norse names – some examples include Ayrton, Barron, Calder & Soren.

I like celtic/ Scottish / Welsh names – some examples include Lowen, Griffin, Malcolm, & Tristan.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

I feel optimistic about this: your styles are so adjacent/overlapping, it feels FATED for success. And you need TWO names, so maybe BOTH of you will get your favorite!

But oh, goodness, I remember how difficult it was to name twins! I’d thought it would be DELIGHTFUL, and then it was so DIFFICULT! What I finally had to do was pretend I was naming them one at a time: pretend I was pregnant with one baby, and what would I name this one? and then pretend it is like two or three years later and I am pregnant again with one baby, and what would I name this one?

And yet it’s impossible to ignore the fact that they WILL be born together, and their names WILL be considered together! (And in my experience, people lovvvvvvvvvve to hear twin names.) So I ended up with two “separate” lists (pretending they were born separately) plus a “twin” list (pairing up all the names from the other lists). My dear hope was that I could find SOMETHING twinny about the names: not the Sharon/Karen or Timmy/Tommy thing from generations ago, but maybe just the same number of syllables/letters, or maybe starting with the same letter, or maybe a similar sound. I failed in that goal (I liked my favorites too much to trade them for something twinnier), and it’s absolutely fine but I do still wish I’d succeeded in finding something a LITTLE twinny! (Their middle names do start with the same letter, which scratches the very edge of that itch.)

Commenters brought it to my attention recently that Norse names are currently favored by white supremacists, not just casually/coincidentally but in a This Is Part of Our Mission kind of way, so what I suggest is that we leave those out for the time being until we find out if those names are going to feel regrettable later on. Of course I don’t mean I think parents CAN’T use them, and of course many names belong to multiple cultures, and of course one such name in a sibling group of non-Nordic names will not make it seem as if you are Trying To Promote White Supremacy. But just in situations where there isn’t a strong reason to use one of those names, I’m suggesting maybe we put them aside for now and see how things go. And in this particular case, your overlap is Scottish names, so that seems like the first area to explore anyway.

I need to say at the outset that I am not generally clear on which names are Scottish and which are, say, Irish, or Celtic. I have them all mixed together in my mind, as well as in many of my baby-name reference books. This may lead me to suggest a name that is RIDICULOUS, and please do tell me gently in the comments section so I can remove it and pretend I didn’t suggest it.

I’m going to start with The Oxford Dictionary of First Names, because it has a specific section for Scottish names.

Aidan

Okay, wait, time out: on this list is Ailbeart, which it says is the Gaelic equivalent of Albert. Would Albert then fall into the category of Scottish names, or is it completely unScottishized by the conversion? Because I am very keen on the name Albert, and would like to see it come back into style, but I want to save my pushiness for the posts where I have a chance. All right, let’s start again:

Aidan
Alasdair
Alec
Angus
Archie
Calum
Cameron
Conall
Douglas
Evander
Ewan, or does it have to be Eóghan to be Scottish?
Fergus, or does it have to be Fearghas?
Findlay
Finlay
Fraser
Gregor
Ian
Lachlan (probably not with Declan)
Logan
Lyall/Lyle
Malcolm
Murray
Neil
Niall
Reid
Roderick
Rory
Ross
Shaw
Teague, or does it etc.

And now a list from The Baby Name Wizard‘s Celtic section:

Aidan
Alastair
Alec
Angus
Bowen
Brennan
Broderick
Brodie
Brogan
Callan
Callum
Camden
Casey
Conall
Connor
Cormac
Cullen
Darby
Desmond
Douglas
Ellis
Evander
Ewan
Fergus
Finian
Finlay
Finn
Finnegan
Flynn
Garrett
Graham
Gregor
Griffin
Ian
Keane
Keegan
Kellan
Kian
Kieran
Lachlan (probably not with Declan)
Logan
Lowen
Lyle
Malcolm
Morgan
Murphy
Neil
Niall
Owen
Quinn
Reid
Rhys
Rory
Rowan
Shaw
Sullivan
Teague
Tiernan

Would anyone like to have some fun coming up with pairings? This is your moment!

I wonder if it would help to go through these lists, or the Scottish/Celtic section of a name book or website, and each of you write down all the names you are willing to even consider (like, any name you don’t actively dislike); then put those names on little slips of paper and spread them out all over a table and start pairing them up. Sometimes a name you’re just sort of okay with can change into a name you LOVE as you start experimenting with it. Or it can go the other way: you can have a name you think you want to use, and then when you start actually trying it out, it fails to please.

More things to experiment with: Do you find you like names that have something in common, like a shared first initial or shared number of syllables or shared sound, or do you find you are more inclined to find names that are quite different? (My twins were fraternal girl/boy twins; I might have felt differently about the twinniness of names if I’d had identical twins.) Do you find your lists are ranked oppositely: that is, your favorites are on his list but way down at the bottom, and his favorites are on your list but way down at the bottom? Is there any joint happiness in the middle of the list, or would you perhaps prefer the method of a friend of mine who had an opposite-ranking issue with her husband: they ended up each choosing one name (the name had to be on the other parent’s list, but it could be way down at the bottom), and in time she said they both came to love both names. There is also some work to be done with middle names: perhaps one parent would come closer to the other parent’s favorite if they could choose the middle name.

Do you find as you makes lists and pairings that actually you are not feeling the Scottish names? It might be necessary to go one level back, and start again with the entire pool of names. Maybe it will turn out that you liked Scottish names for your FIRST baby, but now you want something else.

I have also found it useful, when feeling very stuck on a baby’s name, to think to myself that it is not actually important that we both love the name. What’s important is that we give the baby a serviceable name they can use throughout their life, and I always felt confident we could achieve THAT goal—and also that with time, we would come to love their name because it was THEIRS. Talking with relatives from previous generations, I found they seemed a little baffled by how much energy and stress the current parents (me, they meant me) were putting into name-choosing: they’d gone with a route more like “Well, how about Nancy? Oh, your sister is using it for her daughter. Well, then, how about Barbara? Great! Oh, wait, what about the middle name? Ann? Sure! Done!” My mother-in-law, when questioned on my favorite topic, said for each of her pregnancies she was just thinking about the baby’s name and it was just the name that came to her mind, and then she checked with her husband and he was fine with it, so then they were done. This method does not resonate with me, but it soothes me.

Dear Swistle,

We are expecting a boy this year and are struggling to find a name we love. Our last name rhymes with Inpin@relli, which is obviously a mouthful, so we prefer one or two-syllable first names. Our daughter is Quinn J(oo)liet (but spelled with a u). We have basically eliminated names ending in the -in sound due to our last name, although we decided to break that rule with Quinn and it somehow works. We prefer names that aren’t super popular but are recognizable and easy to pronounce. My husband doesn’t like what he deems “preppy/pretentious” names such as Sawyer, Spencer, and Parker.

The middle name will probably be Simon after my grandfather, although we could also use the S initial or a J initial for my grandmother.

First names we like but aren’t sure about:

Reid- This is currently our front runner. Would this be annoying for the child in school considering how often the word “read” is said? Does it sound nerdy with Simon?

Miles- Seems a little bland to me- maybe because of the similarity to the word mild. It also eliminates a middle name starting with S.

Cole

Graham- Would he be called grammy or graham cracker?

Theo- too popular

Nolan- has that -in ending

Hayes- my husband doesn’t like it

Our original favorite boy name was Ryder but two friends in our orbit have recently used it.

 

I look forward to hearing your thoughts and suggestions! I will definitely provide an update once the baby is born.

I think Reid is great. Perhaps some Reids and/or parents of Reids can weigh in on the Reid/read issue, but my own opinion is that it wouldn’t stop me from using it. I don’t think it seems nerdy with the middle name Simon.

Or would you like Reeve? Reeve Inpin@relli; Quinn and Reeve.

I wonder if Milo would feel a little more interesting than Miles. Milo Inpin@relli; Quinn and Milo.

Nolan + Cole makes me think of Noel, but I suspect in the U.S. it would be irritatingly often confused with Noelle. Noel Inpin@relli; Quinn and Noel.

I do think a Graham would sometimes hear the graham cracker wordplay; perhaps some Grahams or parents of Grahams can weigh in on how much of an issue it is.

I wonder if you’d like Grant: similar to Graham, but no crackers. Grant Inpin@relli; Quinn and Grant.

Or Emmett. Emmett Inpin@relli; Quinn and Emmett.

Or Wyatt. Wyatt Inpin@relli; Quinn and Wyatt.

Grady. Grady Inpin@relli; Quinn and Grady.

Clark. Clark Inpin@relli; Quinn and Clark.

Gage. Gage Inpin@relli; Quinn and Gage.

Lane. Lane Inpin@relli; Quinn and Lane.

Rory. Rory Inpin@relli; Quinn and Rory.

Our last name is Lee (which cuts out a lot of names— more than you’d realize. Can’t use names ending in -ly sound for example, Kelly Lee). Our son is named Henry. Due date December. This is our 2nd and final kid. This one is a Girl.

We will be using Lurlyne as middle name after my grandmother. Yes, slightly weird name but I recognize it’ll be made middle name to not be called that all the time and still honor her.

Names thrown around that my husband hasn’t X’d yet:

Madison
Lauren
Eliza
Rebecca
Cameron
Avery

Names X’d/vetoed by my husband:

Scarlett
Sophie
Anne
Georgina
London
Athena
Hazel
Kelsey
Vienna
Amelia
Kennedy
Eleanor
Charlotte
Caroline

Any suggestions or recommendations? We generally like traditional names for first names that the masses would spell only one way I.e. No “it’s Catherine with a C… or K… or I… or Y… “ I hated growing up and always having to correct people or watch my siblings spell their names etc.

Thanks for any suggestions!

Starting with the list not yet vetoed by the husband, I would say Eliza and Rebecca most fit the preference for traditional names; Madison, Avery, Lauren, and Cameron feel more modern/contemporary. Eliza seems the most straightforward in terms of spelling; Rebecca can be Rebekah, but Rebecca is currently the predominant spelling: according to the Social Security Administration, in 2022 there were 1,065 new baby girls given the spelling Rebecca and 277 given the spelling Rebekah.

Henry and Eliza gives me a strong My Fair Lady association, but I have seen that movie dozens and dozens of times and may not be representative of the general public. Henry and Rebecca is a pleasing combination: I feel as if a current Henry would be most likely to have a little sister Charlotte, Eleanor, or Violet, so the still-traditional-but-less-currently-in-favor name Rebecca feels fresh. And it appears to me from your email that Rebecca is part of your own name, and I am immensely in favor of mothers passing on their names to their children. So as much as I love the name Eliza (it is one of my enduring top favorites), in this case I vote Rebecca with all my heart. Perhaps with the nickname Bex.

I feel disinclined to look any further, so committed am I to Rebecca. But just for fun, a few more combinations:

Bridget Lee; Henry and Bridget
Claudia Lee; Henry and Claudia
Cora Lee; Henry and Cora
Eloise Lee (maybe too much L); Henry and Eloise
Felicity Lee; Henry and Felicity
Florence Lee; Henry and Florence
Josephine Lee; Henry and Josephine
Margaret Lee; Henry and Margaret (nicknames Meg, Daisy, Greta, etc.)
Melinda Lee; Henry and Melinda
Meredith Lee; Henry and Meredith
Rose Lee; Henry and Rose
Rosemary Lee; Henry and Rosemary
Ruby Lee; Henry and Ruby
Sabrina Lee; Henry and Sabrina

Today I heard Henry telling his friends his naming story and, let me tell you, it sounds different that way. “Wow,” one of his friends said, “I take it your parents really love [the TV show that brought the name to my attention].” It made me wonder what happens with those kids who are named after the place where their parents had sex to conceive them. Think ahead, is my feeling here.

His friends were pitching in with their stories, and I couldn’t hear the ones with quieter voices, but one boy said he was pretty sure he was named after [hot male actor] in one of his mom’s favorite movies. This generated some nauseated responses.

My mother-in-law told me she chose her two children’s names casually: the names just came into her head while she was pregnant. (Yes, both names were Top Ten names for their birth years.) Later she pushed me to read one of her favorite books from her college years, and it turned out to have some pretty racy scenes in it, and the two people being racy together had the same names as her two children.

(If you wish to tell your baby’s naming story here to see if it passes the “Telling it to Teenaged Friends” test, feel free.)

Last time we talked about the middle names of one specific graduating high school class. Today it’s first names.

My repeated contention over the years has been that even a Top Ten name is not all that common: parents may be remembering their own classroom experience with the name Jennifer, but Jennifer at its peak was used at well over four times the frequency of the current most common names. In addition, many of us have seen from our own experience that it can come down as much to local trends/whims/coincidences as national statistics: a classroom might have not a single child with any of the top five names, but two kids with the same name ranked down in the 500s.

Here was what I was interested to see: how did the Top Ten shake out in this particular graduating class? These are babies born in 2004-2005; according to The Social Security Administration, here were the top ten names in those years:

(screenshot from https://www.ssa.gov/OACT/babynames/index.html)

(screen shot from https://www.ssa.gov/OACT/babynames/index.html)

Most of those are repeats, which makes things easier. If we include all the names from both years, we get our own custom Top Eleven:

Emily
Emma
Madison
Olivia
Hannah
Abigail
Isabella
Ashley
Samantha
Elizabeth
Ava

Jacob
Michael
Joshua
Matthew
Ethan
Andrew
Daniel
Joseph
Christopher
Anthony
William

In 2004, the top eleven girl names were used for 9.15% of new babies assigned female at birth, and the top eleven boy names were used for 11.59% of new babies assigned male at birth. In 2005, the top eleven girl names were used for 8.80% of new babies assigned female at birth, and the top eleven boy names were used for 10.98% of new babies assigned male at birth. Statistically, we would expect to see approximately those percentages for our own combined Top Eleven for our two combined birth years: an average for 2004/2005 girls would be 8.98%; an average for 2004/2005 boys would be 11.29%.

I’m going to copy my two Top Eleven lists below, and add a tally of how many of each name were in this particular class of 190 students:

Emily 3
Emma 1
Madison 1
Olivia 1
Hannah 3
Abigail 0
Isabella 1
Ashley 1
Samantha 0
Elizabeth 1
Ava 1

Jacob 1
Michael 0
Joshua 0
Matthew 3
Ethan 1
Andrew 2
Daniel 0
Joseph 0
Christopher 4
Anthony 0
William 2

For girls, that’s 13 names in the Top Eleven. I have just realized that to make this strictly accurate, I would need to count how many of the graduates are girls and how many are boys; we are not going to do that, for several reasons. Instead I am going to estimate it’s 50/50, which gives us an estimate of 95 girls, and 13 Top Eleven names: 13.68%, compared to the expectation of 8.98%. For boys, there are also 13 names in the Top Eleven, which gives us the same estimated percentage: 13.68% of the names were Top Eleven names, compared to the expectation of more like 11.29%

So in my particular area, parents are somewhat more inclined than average to use Top Ten names—and especially for girls. And even so: imagine being hesitant to use the name Emma/Jacob/Olivia/Ethan in 2004/2005 because of popularity, but being able to peek into the future and see that your Emma/Jacob/Olivia/Ethan would be the only Emma/Jacob/Olivia/Ethan in their entire graduating class. Imagine avoiding Abigail/Joshua/Samantha/Michael because of the popularity, and then there’s not a single Abigail/Joshua/Samantha/Michael in the entire graduating class.

On to the interesting anomalies. Most of us have an anecdote or two about a classroom that had no Isabellas but two Isadoras, or no Avas but two Avelyns and and Eva and an Eve, or three Josephs going by Joey and two of them also had the same middle name. In this graduating class there were TWO Mavericks. Wouldn’t you feel a little intense about that, if your child were one of the Mavericks? In 2004 the name Maverick was #768 in the U.S., given to only 236 boys in the entire nation! The name Michael, for comparison, was given to 25,465 new baby boys that year! You would feel pretty safe assuming your baby would not have to be Maverick S. in school! And yet! In this particular graduating class, no Michaels and two Mavericks!

Similarly, though less dramatically, this graduating class had two Savannas and no Samanthas. The name Samantha was given to 13,786 new baby girls in 2004; the name Savanna, at #273 that year, to 1,198 (another 5,814 were named Savannah). In this graduating class: 0 Samanthas, 2 Savannas—and you can imagine how you would feel if you were parents who chose Savanna to avoid the popularity of Samantha.

This graduating class had two kids named Kira, which is a little remarkable: the name was #275 in 2004 and #241 in 2005. But to ramp up the remarkable: both of them have surnames starting with G.

The most popular name in the graduating class was Connor, given to six students. In 2004, the name Connor was #38 and was given to .4755% of new babies assigned male at birth; in 2005, it was #48 and .4381%, for an average over the two birth years of .4568%. In a graduating class of 95 boys, we would expect, statistically speaking, approximately 1/2 child named Connor. Instead, we have six. SIX! (Interestingly, not a single repeat of middle name or surname initial among the Connors.)

I recently attended a high school graduation ceremony. My absolute top favorite part of these ceremonies is getting to see everyone’s middle names. This was a batch of approximately 190 babies born in 2004-2005, and here are the middle names that were used more than once:

Rose 11
Elizabeth 10
Marie 10
Lynn 6
Grace 5
Ann/Anne 3
Michelle 3
Renee 3
Catherine 2
Faith 2
Jacqueline/Jacklyn 2
Jane 2
Leigh 2
Madison 2
Riley 2

Michael 6
David 5
James 3
Patrick 3
Andrew 2
Daniel 2
Francis 2
Joseph 2
Matthew 2
Nicholas 2
Richard 2
Ronald 2
Stephen/Steven 2
William 2

I was especially interested in Rose and Elizabeth: my own Elizabeth, whose graduating class this is, has said numerous times over the years that “EVERYONE’S middle name is Elizabeth.” It was neck-and-neck as I was doing the tally: going through the list, I’d add a Rose, then two Elizabeths, then two Roses, then one Elizabeth.

I was a little surprised by how many kids had Lynn and Marie and Ann/Anne as middles: I think of those as being from my own generation—along with Nicole, which at least in this batch of kids seems to have disappeared, so I wonder if its simultaneous use as a first name in the ’70s is what caused it to drop out of sight.

There was a nice assortment of older middle names: Paula, Dorothy, Marion, Lorraine; Bruce, Clarence, Laurence, Conrad.

There were several middle names I hoped were the birth surname of the child’s other parent.

There were quite a few where I wondered if it might be the name of an aunt/uncle/parent, or if it could have just still sounded current to the parents at the time the baby was named: names from my own generation such as Michelle, Allison, Jacqueline, Eric, Scott, Jason.

There were quite a few where I wondered if it was the second-choice name, or if it was The Other’ Parent’s Favorite, or whatever: Olivia, Riley, Ava, Cole, Henry, Jack. (Or Riley/Cole/Henry might have been family surnames.)

There were several middle names that looked to me like they were attempting to honor more than one person. I want to be careful not to put distinctive/identifying information in a public post, but they were names LIKE: RuthEllen, Rose-Leona, Michelle Amanda.

There were only a couple of the sort I would put into the category Objectively Fun: names such as Morning or Magic or Sunflower, where you think “Oh, that’s FUN,” and maybe you briefly wish you hadn’t gone for the family name that was in the top ten for a hundred years and so is the same as pretty much EVERYONE’S family name.

Really what I would have loved best is if each graduate had stood up and told us their name stories. Less talking about bright futures and the first day of the rest of their lives, more talking about was this a family name or did their parents just like it.