Hello, dear Swistle!
I mentioned to you on Twitter this past fall that I was bereft to not have a baby boy to name Alfred, because I’d just met a three year old named Alfred and was completely charmed. My ovaries said, “What’s that? You’d like another baby? We can arrange for that!” My husband Kevin and I were QUITE surprised to find out we’re expecting again—we definitely thought we were done—but we are also delighted. And now to choose a name for this little one before she arrives in June! Normally I love thinking about and discussing baby names, but I’ve had a lot of other stressors going on this pregnancy and haven’t spent a lot of time on it since I was really early in my pregnancy. I’m hoping your and your readers’ thoughts might help me get excited about the naming process.
Surname is four syllables. It starts with Mc- and ends with -ery. It’s a similar rhythm to McAllister, but that -ee ending makes a lot of names sound sing-song-y.
We are having a girl, so Alfred is out. Here are the sibling names (there are a lot of them):
—Emeline Anne (Last syllable with a long I sound, rhymes with Caroline as opposed to Pauline. Goes by Emmy.)
—Samuel Albert (Sam or Sammy)
—Lucy Eleanor (miscarried girl)
—Theodore Peter (Theo)
—Quinn Enoch (miscarried, sex unknown)
—Grace Elizabeth (miscarried girl)
—Poppy James (miscarried, sex unknown)
—Benjamin Charles (Ben or Benji)So the living siblings are Emmy, Sam, Theo, and Benji on a day-to-day basis. I feel quite married to a long name with a nickname, because there are FOUR other kids in the family with this precedent.
All eight of my other children have honor names for their middle names.
We definitely sacrificed the flow of some of the names (or chose less than ideal initials) for the chance to honor loved ones. For this baby, we are leaning towards honoring my husband’s grandmother. Her name is Evenelle (spelled a little differently, but changed for the sake of not being so Google-able). Her parents, who immigrated to the US, apparently made up this name to sound like an American name. She generally goes by Evie (Eh-vee, as opposed to Eve-ee). Depending on the flow with the first name I’m open to either Evenelle or Evie. However, my son Theo has his heart set on naming the baby Joy, so we’re also considering that for a middle name. (Side question: would it be weird to give this baby two middle names if none of the siblings have two middle names?)I’ve thought about naming this baby Elizabeth Eleanor both in honor of her two miscarried sisters and in honor of the family members for whom I originally chose the names, but I’m not sure how that would feel for my newest daughter as she grows up. When I think about if I would like to be named after two miscarried siblings, now as an adult I could appreciate it, but I don’t know that I’d have understood as a child. I do LOVE both of these names and my husband is on board with this idea, but I’m leaning towards scrapping it. I’d be interested in your thoughts and your readers’ thoughts, though. If we DID do this I love the wealth of nickname options with Elizabeth. I’m leaning towards Lizzy or Izzy.
Okay, beyond Elizabeth Eleanor, here is my list so far:
—Margaret (Maisie or Meg)
—Anneliese (Annie)
—Louisa (Lulu…almost certainly too close to Lucy, whom we talk about by name with some regularity)
—Alice (I suppose we could call her Allie for short, but I love Alice as is, so potential issue of no nickname)
—Katherine (Kate)
—Amelia (Millie…is Amelia too close to Emeline?)
—Rose (I love Rosalie but it is very singsong-y with our last name. Maybe scrap a long version and just go with Rose? I’m sure that whatever her formal name is we’d call her Rosie.)
—Birdie (I’m swooning over this as a nickname, but am not sure what long name to use to get to it. Bridget? Kevin hates it so it’s probably out, though I have time to work on him.)Part of me feels meh about this whole list (except for Birdie) and wants to venture into a very different style…Imogen! Lark! Juniper! Pearl! But I don’t think I truly want to do that.
My favorite on my “real” list is probably Margaret (I love the alliteration with our surname). Kevin likes Katherine best. Katherine has been on our list for every pregnancy and feels extremely boring to me this time around…probably because I’ve considered it 8 other times. And as if choosing a name with one’s spouse isn’t hard enough, Emmy is 12 and very invested in the name. Emmy likes Anneliese best (from my list…of her own choosing she likes Veronica and Victoria, in case you’re interested in a data point on what names 12-year-olds like). I love Felicity but it doesn’t go well with our surname.
Okay! I am open to suggestions! I would love your thoughts!
Love, Ellen
When I got to the part about using the names of miscarried siblings as honor names for this baby, my hand flew to cover my mouth. I vote no, and I vote it while making earnest, sustained eye contact.
I can’t easily explain my strength of feeling on this. One of my daily rituals is checking the obituaries, and so I know it used to be very common for a family to reuse the name of a child who had died. I don’t know what the motivation was, at the time: was it because they still wanted to name a child after dear Uncle Thomas? was it in honor of the child who had died? And I don’t know how the kids who were given the names felt about it. But I do know it used to be common. It’s just: it’s not common now. In the context of Now rather than Then, it gives a feeling I would describe as “my hand flew to cover my mouth.”
It would feel different to me if you had intended to use those honor names for other babies, but had miscarried and had not used the names after all. Then the names Elizabeth and Eleanor could still be after the original honorees. But the babies were named, and their names are listed in the sibling group; those names have been used by other siblings and are no longer available to be used by the new baby, any more than the names Emeline and Anne are available.
It would also feel different to me if you had a family tradition of, for example, using Eleanor as the middle name for all of your daughters. Or if some of your other children had been named after their siblings. But neither of those is the case here. I strongly advise you to consider all sibling names Taken and Unavailable.
I think it would be fine to give this baby two middle names, though it’s not a pattern-break I’d want to do at this point, and I think your firstborn might be peeved if you used her brother’s name preferences and not hers! When I was pregnant with the twins, Rob (age 6 at the time) vigorously wanted to give one of the babies the middle name Plum, and we did consider it, and I did think it would have been a fun/cute story, but we didn’t end up doing it, and Rob no longer even remembers wanting this. Joy is a much harder name to resist than Plum, but I think my plan would be the same: if there was another middle name I would otherwise have used, I would go ahead and use that, and encourage the child to use the name Joy as their own special name for the baby.
I find I am very much hoping Evenelle will be the version that goes best with the first name and surname. Evie is nice, but it’s a common current nickname; Evenelle feels special, and I suspect you would enjoy it every single time you filled out paperwork.
From your list of first-name options, my top favorite with a sister named Emeline is Anneliese. The two names are parallel enough to give me a little thrill, but the sounds are quite different. Anneliese Evenelle is majestic.
Amelia would be too similar to Emeline for me. I realize that may seem at odds with my feelings about Anneliese.
My second favorite from your list is Margaret. I like the alliteration too, and all the nickname options.
I’ve heard Birdie used for Bridget but also for Bernadette, Roberta, Bertha, Alberta, and Bernice. These won’t work with sibling names and/or your surname, but in case others have landed here looking for more options, it seems like it would also work well for Ember, Emberley, Emberlyn, Liberty, Kimber. But I think it can also come from calling a nice little baby girl your little birdy. I think it could be sweet as a pet name for Margaret, and this could tie in nicely to you telling Theo he can call her Joy: different family members might have different nicknames for her, and that’s delightful.
I think Imogen would work well and wouldn’t be a big style jump. Nicknames Genna or Midge or Immy (similar to Izzy), or Idgie like in Fried Green Tomatoes; and it sounds a little like Joy. But it seems very close to Benjamin.
I wonder if you’d like Genevieve; it was high on my own list. I worried she’d be called Genny/Jenny, but that’s starting to sound good to me again. There’s also Evie or Vivi or or Gigi (probably not with Benji) or Ginny (maybe also not with Benji) or Neevie. Genevieve Evenelle has a lot of repeated sounds; I might be swayed into thinking about suggesting Genevieve Joy? It’s so delightful.
Or Minerva/Minnie. A little similar to Veronica.
And because you like Margaret and Millie, I bring you one of the names most dear to my heart: Millicent. Millicent/Millie. Just give it time to simmer.
Name update:
Hello, dear Swistle!
I am writing to update you on my baby’s name, which you were kind enough to post about at the end of March.
I appreciated reading everyone’s thoughts on using the middle names of the baby’s miscarried sisters. In the time between sending my email and your post I’d had a good chat with a friend about it, and I came to the conclusion that without knowing the baby’s personality it wasn’t a good decision. Maybe she’ll be a happy-go-lucky person who wouldn’t be bothered at all (or maybe she’d have really liked the connection to her sisters!), but maybe she’ll be a very sensitive child who feels things deeply and the names would have felt like a weight. So! Even before I read your thoughts I’d decided to regretfully let Elizabeth Eleanor go and keep looking. (A special thank you to the commenters who offered such kind words of sympathy for our losses and shared their own stories of lost babies and subsequent naming decisions—I appreciated it very much.)
Everyone’s positive comments about Evenelle made me feel much more confident in using it as a middle name. And thank you to everyone who was looking out for Emmy and the disparity of considering Theo’s favorite name Joy and not her names. The reason for this is because I’d told her I thought it best for her to save her very favorite names for her own children or pets someday and she was VERY on board with the idea of saving them.
Okay, with all of that background out of way, introducing our daughter Margaret Evenelle. I’m pretty sure we’ll call her Maisie, but we love the wealth of nickname options and we’ll see how it shakes out in the coming weeks. Thank you again to you and your readers!
Another sweet way to get to the nickname Birdie is to name her Phoebe, Louisa Lark, Mavis, Alcyone, Aracari, Jacana, or even Robin… essentially, an actual bird name.
But if Kevin loves Katherine, and you love Birdie… you could name her Katherine with the nickname of Wren… which easily leads to her being called Birdie at home. Katherine Evenelle? Wren McSomething-y.
Emmy, Sam, Theo, Benji, and Wren. Is Wren kind of close to Emmy? Yes, certainly. Emmy might just LOVE it! (Emmy and Evie are pretty close, too.)
The similarities make beautiful bookends for your family.
Congratulations and best wishes to your whole family. Children are such a blessing!
WAIT isn’t “Catherine called Birdy” already a thing? They could name her Katherine with a nickname Birdie!!
Literally reading that book right now and came here to suggest it. It’s Catherine, but close enough.
We accidentally did exactly this. Our Katherine couldn’t pronounce her whole name and we had been calling her Wrenbird, and so she named herself Birdie in order to say “Nono, BIRDIE do it!” It is still her home-name.
Our oldest is nicknamed Lark. Her first name is long and rare with a strong Lar- sound (Hilaria).
A friend of my mother was given the name of a sibling who died. She said it gave her the creeps to go to the graveside and see another person with her name. Worse yet, when her parents were angry or upset with her, she felt certain the original Margery Ann would not have caused such grief to her parents.
It gives me a thrill to go to the graveside of the great-aunt and great-great grandmother who have the exact same as I do.
The idea of Katherine with nickname Wren / Birdie is so creative!
What about a variation of Elizabeth with nickname Izzy – Isobel has a similar feel to Imogen I think, and could be different enough from the older sister’s name to be tied in without being a duplicate.
A longer Rose name like Rosalyn or Rosanna?
Beatrice nn Birdie?
Personally, I think it’d be fine to name the new baby Elizabeth Eleanor, especially since this isn’t the full name of either of her miscarried sisters, but is instead their middle names. I don’t see this as being much different than having honor names from other deceased relatives.
I feel the same. But I’m not averse to sharing names in families.
I don’t know the actual motivation of people who reused names in the past but I can see the grief involved in never saying/hearing the name of your child around the house anymore, especially in that special way we say our babies’ names. It makes sense to me to want to hear it again.
There was a book written some 30 years ago called Catherine, Called Birdy, (Karen Cushman) about life in the thirteenth century. I haven’t seen the movie they recently made based on the book (loosely), but I personally loved the book as a tween/teen. And that does give precedent for using your favorite nickname with your husband’s favorite name on the list. 🤷♀️
That said, Margaret is my favorite from your list.
I think Birdie is a nickname for Beatrix, which I think works great with Evenelle and your other sibling names.
The Birdie I know of was originally named Constance and most people call her Connie, so it is my option that Birdie works for any name. My top choice is Margaret Evenelle nn Birdie or Maggie. I’m also partial to Millicent nn Millie.
I’m so happy for your family!
Oh wow, I ADORE your names and a few of my children have the same ones! And all of your “top list” are ones that I had on my own lists. My son was supposed to be Bridget, and Birdie was going to be one of her nicknames. And Margaret nn Meg was always up there in our top 3. Anneliese and Katherine nn Kate would have been considerations if we had a 4th. My husband didn’t like Louisa, but to me it’s sooooo lovely! Lulu! I also love Annabel nn Anna/Annie/Belle/Bella – throwing that one out there. Virginia (V/Ginny)? Vivienne (Vi/Vivi)? I can’t remember if those were listed already. Rosamund/Rosemary/Rosalie/Rosette/Rosetta? I like Rosalie with Emeline. Emmy and Rosie – too cute!!
I think Anneliese is my favourite – I just love it – and I would go for broke – use as many middle names as you’d like. You only live once! ;)
Evelyn Joy, nicknamed Evie (Eh-vee)
Evenelle Joy, nicknamed Evie (Eh-vee) or Nellie.
Margaret Louise
Bernadette Evenelle (nicknamed Birdie)
Anneliese June
Victoria June
I lean toward feeling that using miscarried siblings’ names is a bit odd, although… I feel less strongly against reusing the name of a child who had died at an older age? Not reusing the same first name as a first name, but I could see using the same middle or first-as-middle or middle-as-first (I feel the iffiest about this option).
I think infant loss strikes me differently because I have a personal sense that in the absence of substantial memories with the child, and especially in a case where you never got to meet them, their name ends up being the primary token of their identity. I suspect that a living child with the same name would quickly overshadow the original association – and in this case I really would want to retain that association.
FWIW, I’ve heard of large families who reused a middle as a first name even among living siblings. It feels odd to me, but… not unthinkably distasteful? One of my brothers actually lobbied for his middle name to be used as the youngest’s first name.
I agree that Amelia and Emmeline are too close but Anneliese and Emmeline are fine, for whatever reason. And I adore Imogen (I just encountered it IRL for the first time and it was one of those names that is absolutely as good as I thought it was going to be), but I do think it’s too close to Benjamin.
Would Katherine feel fresher with a different nickname? Kat feels fresh and distinctive, but very natural. And Kit is spunky and delightful and totally ready for a comeback. Or Kitty! I’m on the fence about whether that works as a call name/how you introduce yourself, but I think it’s delightful as a family pet name. Or a double name? Katie Nelle? Katie Joy? (FWIW there is a niche but controversial YouTuber named Katie Joy… but probably irrelevant by time she would have a clue) Mix things up for the last baby and do Evie Kate?
I wanted to suggest Rosemary but I suspect it won’t work with the last name. I have the same problem. *sob* Rosemae?
Adelaide? Vivienne? Eloise? Camille? Charlotte? Josephine?
My father in law is named after his deceased brothers — lost as a newborn and a young toddler in a measles outbreak — or after the family members that those names honor. I’d strongly advise against it. I suppose we do think of those poor babies, dead over 70 years, more than we would otherwise — but it does mean that three generations on there’s a huge weight to honor names — that sometimes it seems like the honor is more important than the infant. It made it hard to break away from using honor names — and honestly, it made using honor names from my family nearly impossible given what my husband’s family would do to make an honor name happen.
Why not Evenelle Joy? I love that name and she could be Ellie, Ella, Van-ella, Eh-vey, EJ, or lots of other options.
Also, if you’re not sure about Alice, would you like Allison or Alma or something else Alfred-like? Fredrica? Freida?
Ellen, if you’re reading this, I’m so sorry for your losses. The names you’ve chosen for all your kids are beautiful. We lost one baby to miscarriage and later used his first name (Graham) as a second middle name for another one of our kids. Our living child who shares the name feels a particular connection with that baby; at least, he’s asked a fair number of questions about him and keeps track of how old he would be now and what it will be like to meet him in heaven. I think he likes having that special connection; he asked us one time why we gave him that name, and we told him that, like all the middle names we’ve given our kids, it was in honor of one of our family members — in this case, his sibling who we haven’t gotten to meet yet. Almost all (with only 1 exception for 5 living kids and a total of 9) of the middle names we’ve chosen are also saint names, as well. So if you want to use those names, in honor of your miscarried babies or other family members, I think that’s fine — especially since it’s the middle names, which I’m guessing most people wouldn’t even know.
I’m going to suggest some other Rose-type names in case one clicks for you:
Roseanne
Rosa
Rosatta
Rosabel
Rosella (fixes the last name issue)
Rosalyn
Rosine
Primrose
Rosiana
Rowan (I’ve heard Roe as a nickname for Roaie and feel it could be done the other way around)
If you use Elizabeth, I’d tell her (and everyone else) it was after the relative, not the miscarried sibling.
From the rest of your list I like Margaret, Katherine, and Anneliese best for you. How about Rosemary as a longer Rose-adjacent name?
Joy could be a nice middle for most of the names on your list. I like the idea of using Phoebe to get to Birdie. I was brainstorming other bird names (Robin, Sparrow, Wren) but none seemed to fit in with your style as well.
How about Alexandra, Anna, Christina, or Susannah? They all have useable nicknames.
Nella would be a sweet nickname for Evenelle if you decide to use it in the first name spot. I actually find that I really love Evenelle Alfred, which would be fun (it would switch the honor name order but that doesn’t feel like too big of a deal to me). I also love the name Margaret and feel like nicknames would just naturally occur with that name—my personal favorite is Maggie.
Anneliese Evenelle also sounds amazing; it definitely falls under “a name I would choose for myself.”
I’m so glad to hear of your impending joy. May your lost ones’ memories be eternal. We also speak of the one we lost by name. Her memory is a joy now, a part of our family story. I decided, ultimately, that I felt comfortable using names that are very similar (Maria and Mary-Rose) because the names would not get confused the way living siblings might. But not the same name as the one we lost. And then that kid was a boy so it was a moot point.
I think kids are very sensitive to shame and unwantedness, and some sensitive kids almost invent it sometimes—I remember saying nobody loved me because I’d been yelled at, and I see that reaction in my own kids when they have been scolded. It is easy to put an absent person on a pedestal, and so I’d worry that my kid would convince themselves their parents wanted the other, lost sisters instead. So. Elle is in Elizabeth and Eleanor and Evenelle, and I’d consider using just Elle in honor of the 3 family members (not the lost siblings). But I would not personally use Elizabeth or Eleanor.
this is exactly why sibling names shouldn’t be reused, very well said.
Ellen, I’m sorry for your losses.💔
I’m so happy to hear about your happy surprise!
I think Margaret is lovely with the sibling set (and what a lovely sibling set you’ve chosen!). I think Imogen works well, too. It feels a little trendy in North America, but has been used in Britain a long time (since Shakespeare used it first), so it is an old, established name like the others.
If you’d really like to get to Birdie as a nickname, might I suggest Beatrice? Your husband could use the nn Bee or Bea. We almost named our last child this to get the nn Birdie.
I understand the pull to use names your order children have suggested. We agonized over whether to use a name suggestion made by our 14 y.o. (Swistle posted our query and readers helped us decide!). We used her suggestion and we’re happy we did, but I could have just as easily not have done and felt that was the right choice.
You have lots of lovely choices, so your baby will have a great name no matter what! Congrats!
I love the idea of a real-life “Catherine called Birdy”—but I also kinda love the idea of leaning into the sibling preferences and calling her Veronica Joy—great name!
I vote for Bernadette and your choice of best middle name, either Evanelle or Joy would be my pick! Bernadette called Birdy is very charming and both the full name and nickname sound great with the surname.
Just realized Emmy and Evie (Eh-vee) are pretty similar sounding as nicknames. Not sure if that’s a deal breaker for you. Evenelle also lends itself to nicknames Nella, Nellie, or Eva (Ee-va) if you want different sounds.
Ooh, what about Rosalind with the nickname of Lindy?
Winnifred since you can’t use Alfred.
Emmy and Winnie
Winnifred Evenelle
Evenelle Joy is a gorgeous name if you’re open to it in first.
Ellen, I’m sorry some of your babes are not in your arms today. We have a number of miscarried sibling names we could use – one I love so much I long to reuse it – and I think this is one of those issues you’ll have to resolve for yourself in your own heart.
Katherine is majestic, queenly, classic, and I don’t meet many little ones these days wearing that name. If you happened to settle on it this time around, I think it’d be that your very own little Katherine (called Birdie) finally came along. Sometimes the right name waits for the right child.
Evenelle is lovely and its story even more so, AND it contains your name (backwards) within it so there’s a hidden honor for Mama. Katherine Evenelle, Birdie El/Elle … I feel very satisfied about the balance of beauty and meaning here.
Oooh, I love the Ellen spelled backwards!! I think Katherine Evenelle is just lovely. Kitty, Kit, Kate, lots of options…
After reading all the comments and lovely suggestions, I vote for Katherine Evenelle as well. She can be Birdie and I love that Evenelle includes Ellen and has the “El” in it as a not to Elizabeth and Eleanor.
How about a combo of Margaret and Anneliese?
Marlise Evenelle. nn Maisie, Marlie, Mae, Maeve, Marlo