Dear Swistle,
I love your column and your commitment to balance between parents in naming! My partner and I feel similarly, and that’s an area where we could really use your help.
We are due with our first and almost certainly only child, a girl, in March. We were trying to conceive for a while and have developed a relatively stable shortlist, though now that this is actually happening, we’re wondering if we should open it up to new possibilities and conversely, how we will ever narrow it down. Any ideas for names to add or cut would be appreciated!
We are using my partner’s surname, which is Beach (but spelled like the tree). We decided to go with it for a variety of reasons, and I have 51% say in the first name as part of the deal. We’d also like to use a middle name from my family to help balance things out. But that’s where it gets tricky – there are “dynamics” in my family that mean many potential choices could result in hurt feelings/drama/guilt. The fact that this will be our only child increases the pressure. My last name doesn’t work well as a middle, and I never liked my middle name much. Any ideas on ways to balance the name without using a family name? Is that even possible?
One other note on honour names – a couple of names on our shortlist are family names, and if we use one of those, we’ll probably give our daughter a middle name that is hers alone.
On to the shortlist:
Mary: a family name on both sides (non-contentious). We love that it’s so recognizable but not very common, at least for babies. Only concern is that it might be too plain? We get a lot of underwhelmed reactions.
Alice: my maternal grandmother – another non-contentious honour name. So versatile. By far the most common (#11 nationwide, #44 in our province) which is the main drawback. Also, I think the name is very nice and checks a lot of boxes, but it doesn’t grab me the way some of the others do.
Bernice: this was my favourite, and my partner wasn’t that keen, and I more or less talked myself out of it. But now suddenly it’s become my partner’s top choice and I’m not sure if I can get back on board! I love the nickname options (Bernie, Bebe). I can’t decide if it’s great or too much with the last name. And is it unpopular for a reason? Too clunky?
Sylvia: the forest is meaningful to us, and it’s a pretty name. My partner has cooled on it, feeling it might be too much in grandma (rather than great-grandma) territory.
Linnea: lovely name, and meaningful to us for the botanical connection. Concerns: might be mispronounced, is just a little outside our usual name style, and might be too pretty?
Cecily: We like that it’s light but also serious-sounding. Concerns: a little hard to say, and the meaning “blind” is not super appealing.
Agnes: one of my partner’s favourites. I like it, but I dislike the nickname Aggie, and I don’t love “chaste” as a meaning.
Considered but rejected: Dorothy, Veronica, Helena, Cora, Estelle.
Boy names we liked: Laurence nn Laurie, Alistair, Ansel, James, Norbert, Jasper.
We are in Canada, which I hope is close enough to the US in naming climate that you will feel able to help. The only significant difference I can see, for our purposes, is the higher popularity of the name Alice here. Oh, and also that Bernie probably has a milder Sanders connotation in Canada!
Thank you so much for considering this (long) letter! We promise to write with an update if chosen.
R0semarie (R0sie) and Patr1ck
Well, let’s see, you’ve already considered some of my favorite ideas for bringing more balance to a name: using your own surname, using your own middle name, using family names from your side of the family. And you have already agreed that you will have more say in the first name; 1% more of the say seems…slim, considering the 100% sacrifice of your surname and 100% use of his, but I am just going to take 51% to mean it’s up to you, and that you will actually use that edge instead of choosing the name the two of you would have agreed on anyway even without the deal, and that way we’re all happy.
I will mention some ideas that you have likely already considered, but maybe you haven’t! And even if you have, perhaps they will be useful to someone else who is going through the same situation. One idea is to use your own first name. Men do this absolutely constantly; women, much less often. And your first name gives a lot of options to fit with a variety of first names, depending on to what extent each option feels like Your Name: R0se, R0sie, R0semarie, maybe variations such as R0salie and R0semary. My favorite would be to use R0semarie, but not if that doesn’t feel like Your Name—like, if that’s your Only When I’m in Trouble name. In that case I’d be more inclined to use R0sie. But I’ll note that men named James who have always gone by Jim or Jamie still tend to name their sons James, not Jim or Jamie.
Another idea is to use names that are meaningful to you in other ways than family names. Did you love Anne of Green Gables as a child (Anne, Cordelia, Marilla)? Little Women (Josephine, Margaret, Elizabeth, Amy)? Five Children and It (Anthea, Jane)? All of a Kind Family (Ella, Henrietta, Sarah, Charlotte, Gertrude)? The Five Little Peppers (Mary/Polly, Sophronia/Phronsie)? Are there books and movies you consider your all-time favorites? Do you have favorite scientists, politicians, actors, authors, poets?
Let’s look now at the first names. The three that align most with my OWN tastes (which is not the question here) are Sylvia, Linnea, and Cecily. I went to school with a Linnea (the lynn-NAY-ah pronunciation), and found her name endlessly pleasing to say; it was on my own baby-name list for each pregnancy. I don’t think Sylvia is too grandma; I think it’s well ready to come back into style—and considering how similar it is to the very popular Olivia, I’m surprised it isn’t more common already. I think it has a lovely sound: light/silvery but grounded/solid. I agree with your assessment of Cecily, and I don’t find the meaning to be an issue.
In fact, let’s do a little side-paragraph on the meaning of Cecily. I’m looking in The Oxford Dictionary of First Names, which says nothing about that meaning under Cecily. But under Cecil, it says that Cecil is a surname name, and that the Cecils were Welsh; it then adds: “In the Middle Ages Cecil was occasionally used as an English form of Latin Caecilius (an old Roman family name derived from the byname Caecus ‘blind’).” Are you following this? I had to re-read it like a dozen times, and I had to look up the word byname, which apparently means nickname and/or early surname (like from when surnames were used to distinguish between two people with the same name, like Isaac the Baker and Isaac the Bearded). But what I’m getting here is that the name Cecil is a Welsh surname that does not mean blind or have anything to do with blindness. But “in the Middle Ages,” people “occasionally” said they were using Cecil or Cecilia as a form of the Latin name Caecilius. And that Caecilius is a surname that came from some ancestor being called Isaac the blind, and the word for blind was caecus. This feels like a lot of big leaps to get to the idea that the name Cecily means blind. Nevertheless, Saint Cecilia in the Catholic tradition is considered the saint of the blind, so that perhaps locks it in for many. [Edited to add: This tidbit about Saint Cecilia is apparently not true. This is where I got the (mis)information: https://stmatthewmonroe.org/st-cecilia.]
Well. I wonder if you would like Celeste?
I’m not going to go on a similar journey for Agnes, because it’s a name your partner is more in favor of than you are, and I am glad to see those names but am not considering them strong contenders. I will say that other books list the meaning of Agnes as more like pure/holy/lamb (agnus is Latin for lamb).
I think the name Mary is similar to the name John, in that it seems so very ordinary and plain on paper, but springs to life with freshness on an actual child. There was one single Mary in school with my kids, and when I first heard her name I thought “MARY!!” with amazement, hearing it as if for the first time as a name rather than as almost a name stand-in. It feels saturated because of its many previous generations of popularity—but in this current generation of babies, it is rare and surprising. It is much higher in the Social Security Administration‘s rankings than I’d expect (#136 in 2022), and I have wondered if that is regional (i.e., in some areas of the U.S., there is a Mary per household), or if it is due to a large number of children being given the name but then going by a different name. I would be interested to hear other people’s experiences with the name in their region.
I am intrigued by the name Bernice. It has been off my radar. I remember a Bernice on the TV show Designing Women. (That used to be one of my favorite shows. I wonder if it holds up to modern re-watching?) Other than that, I’m not sure I’ve encountered any. I think Bernie or Birdy would be adorable nicknames. Bernice makes me think of the names Beatrice and Beatrix and Bernadette.
Alice, Bernice, and Agnes all merge a bit with the surname, creating a “speech” sound. This is not any sort of deal-breaker, but it’s the kind of thing I like to think about ahead of time.
Because you like Alice and Cecily, and because you like name meanings, I suggest the name Felicity. It means happy/lucky.
Because you like Laurence for a boy, I wonder if you would like Florence?
And because it came to mind while I was writing the post, I suggest the name Harriet. I feel it shares vibes with Agnes and Alice and Bernice and Sylvia.
If it were up to me, this is the list I’d be working with:
Celeste R0semarie Beach
Felicity R0semarie Beach
Florence R0semarie Beach
Harriet R0semarie Beach
Linnea R0semarie Beach
Sylvia R0semarie Beach
And the one that is currently my own frontrunner is Sylvia R0semarie Beach. It’s a first name that is on your shared shortlist and has meaning to both of you but you like it a little more than your partner does, which feels like it puts your 1% to good use; and it uses your own first name as the middle name, which gives her a uncontestable family honor name that goes a fair way to balance the weight of your partner’s family surname.
Name update:
Dear Swistle,
Thanks so much to you and your readers for the thoughts and suggestions! It gave us a lot to consider. A funny thing happened as we were testing out the names on our shortlist (we used each for a week): Alice wore so well! It went from unexciting to the top of my list. Once baby arrived on March 21, it still felt right. With my maternal grandmother’s name as first the name was satisfyingly balanced, and we chose a middle we liked for its style and meaning. Alice Esme Beach is now 3 weeks old and a true delight! Thanks again for your help.
R0sie and Patr1ck
It sounds like Mary (or a variation) is your slam dunk honour name. Non-contentious, you like it. I say or a variation because maybe that’s where you can find something less ‘boring’ (although I 100% do not find Mary boring and would LOVE to meet a baby Mary – I’m in Canada too and while I’ve met a child Marie and a Mary Jane, not a Mary yet.)
Marion
Marianne
Mary Jane
Then she gets her very own name in the middle spot! Something about the forest perhaps? Like Sylvie or Sylvia! (or borrow Jasper from your list if it’s about ‘that’ Jasper.)
I love Sylvie for you too. I know a few adult Sylvias – and they’ve said they’re not fans of their grandma names LOL but Sylvie feels so fresh and lovely and I actually like the repetition of Sylvie Beach.
Other musty but ready names you may like? Dolores (Dolly, Dee, Lolo), Florence, Lucille, Maude.
My votes are Mary Jane Sylvia Beach or Sylvie Marion Beach.
Good luck!
I like the idea of using your first name as the middle, but if you don’t, how about making a double-barreled first name with Mary? Mary Alice is my favorite since Alice is a family name from your side and Mary nods to your name, but it works with pretty much your whole list.
Rosemary! Combo name that includes mom’s name and Mary.
I agree with many commentors that Mary is sweet and fresh! I also love using your name somewhere in your daughter’s!
In regards to Bernice, I wonder if you’d feel more inclined toward Bernadette? It feels slightly more feminine that Bernice, and still gives you nickname possibilities of Bernie, Be, and Etta etc.
Congrats and best of luck with your naming journey!
I think Mary Alice is a perfect name.
I know everyone has to do it their own way but I will say we used my (male) partner’s surname and in exchange we:
– used my last name as the middle name, and there is no world in which my last name is anything except a last name. I have family friends who used the mom’s very “last name” last name as a middle for all three of their kids and their kids all liked it and identify as much as a “her last name” as “his last name” (hope that makes sense) and it gave me confidence to do it too. My last name is something like “McClwyd” – ie it’s not a first name at all, for anyone.
– I got to choose the first name, and my spouse wasn’t allowed to veto any of my names. In reality of course I wasnt going to pick a name that turned out to be the name of his childhood bully or something, and I did want him to make lists so I could know what he liked. But it’s more like we said I had 100% first and middle name rights and in reality I had 100% middle name choice and 90% first name choice. We both liked the name, but I loved it and it grew on him. When my daughter was born he looked at me and asked what her name was and I confirmed it was the name we had been talking about.
All that to say you don’t need a “namey” last name to use it as a middle, and you don’t need to settle for “51%” naming rights without clarity of what exactly that means, unless that’s truly what works for you (which it might!).
I read in a baby book that at one time Agnes was so popular in Scotland that they also spelled it backwards as Senga for a baby name option. Which is a strong commitment to the name Agnes! But Senga is kind of cool on it’s own.
I have an Aunt Senga! She is from Scotland and named for her mother, Agnes :)
I love Mary! You have many good choices on your list.
My faves combo is Mary Agnes ♡♡♡♡♡. But I love Linnea & Sylvia as well. If you’re open to 3 names…
Linnea Mary Agnes
Sylvia Mary Agnes
I don’t like how the syllables fall with the double B using Bernice or the rhyme of Bernice with the last name.
Bernie Beach is very cute though…if you could get there with a different first…Albertine or Gilberta. Mary Albertine or Mary Sylvia Albertine, called Bernie Beach, would be both lovely & adorable.
SO MANY great names here!! (Both on your list and Swistle’s list!)
My favourite would be Linnea.
I remembered a charming character named Bernice, and had to look it up: it is the daughter in the movie Spanglish. I don’t even remember the movie, but found actress Sarah Steele adorable, and thus Bernice has such a positive association for me!
I love the idea of using your name as the middle name! Regardless of what you choose, you could add your own surname as a second middle name, too.
And one more idea as a variant of Mary – my friend’s little girl is called Mari (rhymes with starry).
Looking forward to the update!
I really, really like Mary and Alice. And go with some form of your first name as the middle. Perfect!
And on a the Designing Women subject, I recently rewatched the series on one of those weird free channels (i.e. Attena or METV or something like that) and I think it holds up well. Especially the first 4 seasons or so. Honestly lots of topical episodes that make you kind of sad that things are still topical 35 years later, but they made me laugh.
Mary Alice Beach!!!!! You both love Mary, and you clearly love the set of names that sound like Alice, including Alistair.
DH & I had planned our kids’ names way in advance, too (we also had fertility issues), and while we played with other options, we ended up with the same top-of-the-list names and haven’t regretted it, not even with our youngest’s name, which isn’t truly our style. (She’s named for the grandmother neither kid ever met.)
I’d recommend using Rosemary as the first name. It is a triple honor name (you, your side, and your partner’s side) but leans in your favor.
And it gives you so many awesome nickname options: Rose, Rosie, Rosa, Marie, Mary, Maria, Polly, Sem, Emary… possibilities are endless!
Rosemary Sylvia Beach
Hmm, your name is R0semarie and you have Mary on the list for first names. What about Mary Rose? Seems like a bit of a twofer as a nod to your name, but you’d each have a distinct first name/call name.
In general, I do love the idea of your first name (or a variation of it) as her middle name.
From your list, I love Sylvia and Linnea-and together they make me think of Lydia. Ines/Inez is a variation of Agnes but without the Aggie nickname you don’t care for. Honestly, the only name I’m not crazy about from your list is Bernice. But I have a feeling part of that is just because I’ve never met a Bernice (I like similar names like Beatrice and Bernadette) so I’d probably warm up to it pretty quickly if I ever meet a little baby Bernice.
I feel like Mary is a good balance as an honour name for Rosemarie. Mary is my favourite girl name and I think it is fresh and gorgeous.
St Cecilia is better known as the patron saint of music if that’s a better connotation. Cecily is a gorgeous royal name with classic usage. Cecily Rose is a lovely combination.
Yep, came here to say- St Cecilia is for music, St Lucy is your gal for blindness! Cecily Rose is gorgeous as Rose softens Cecily <3
sylvia reminds me of “sylvan,” so “sylvia beach-with-two-Es” hits my ear as forest-themed in a cutesy way, which is (for me!!) a mark against it. i love mary alice (and you could call her mab as an in-family nickname if you wanted, from the initials!). i also love linnea. linnea r0semarie beach!
Sylvia Beach rang a bell for me do I just googled. She was a publisher and the owner of Shakespeare & Company bookstore in Paris in the 1920s and 1930s. A fascinating namesake!
Came here to say this! Truly the best namesake. Also the name of a book hotel in coastal Oregon, that I feel like Swistle readers would likely appreciate: http://sylviabeachhotel.com/welcome/
I like the name Sylvia but adore the nickname Sylvie. Also love Linnea, and concur with Swistle that Mary has a freshness on an actual person even though it seems a little too plain on paper.
I very much like Swistle’s final suggestion. I really think Sylvia/Sylvie are going to be almost as popular as Sophia/Sophie in 10 years. I also wanted to thow out Agatha as an alternative to Agnes.
Food Network host Molly Yeh has a daughter named Bernadette Rosemary who goes by Bernie and has both her parents’ last names! Molly’s restaurant is named after her.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BvpD-AZgmuG/?hl=en
I absolutely love swistle’s suggestion of Felicity! So beautiful and underused and the meaning of “happy” is so sweet.
Felicity R0se
Felicity Agnes
Felicity Bernice
If Mary feels a bit plain to you then how about Meredith? Meredith Beach sounds so nice.
Meredith R0se
Meredith Linnea
Meredith Bernice
I will say I have never been a fan of my middle name (Michelle) but I loved the idea of using it for my daughter’s middle name because the rhythm fit with what we wanted and that would have given it greater meaning to me. I had a boy, though.
I agree with Swistle that Sylvia feels totally ripe for a comeback – much more so than Bernice (although I think Bernice is usable, too).
Cecilia is actually the patron saint of music, and St. Lucy is the patron of the blind. I think the blindness association comes entirely from Caecilius, and I’ve only ever heard the reference in the context of “Does this make the name unusable????” But I’m also very ambivalent toward name meaning in general.
You said family names were hard, but then gave two examples of non-contentious family names. If you don’t use Alice or Mary for a first name, could you just use one as a middle? Or even use them together… since Mary is on both sides you still end up balanced, and both Mary Alice and Alice Mary are lovely. Mary Alice would also make a nice double name if you want something a little more “exciting,” and could sort of mirror your own double name.
If this is your only child Linnea being a stylistic outlier isn’t a huge issue, although if there’s still a chance of another it’s worth at least considering. I think Linnea and Sylvia work nicely together.