Dear Swistle,
I’ll preface this by saying that my actual problem might just be that the prospect of naming a whole entire person is too daunting, having never met the child in question. But possibly I’ve just given myself too many options to consider and that’s what’s overwhelming? At any rate, I’m turning to you, the best naming advice-giver/therapist on these internets.
My husband and I are expecting our first (likely only) child, a girl due in about 8 weeks. He and I share a first initial, so we have at least rejected all names beginning with the letter J (including Josephine, which is a favorite and thus contender for a middle name.) She’ll get both our last names, so her last name will sound something like Otherword-Mitten (to hyphenate or not, another thing I have too much time to consider in These Times!)
When we learned the baby’s sex, we came up with a fairly long list of potential names and have tried out one name a week from the list since. Names we both like go on a list on the fridge with potential middles in a column next to each. We’ve been at it for a while, and maybe the novelty of the game has worn off, but we haven’t come up with a fridge name in well over a month. (This week is Victoria, and we are both meh on it.) One major similarity between the fridge names is multiple nickname options. The name Charlotte (nn Charlie) would, I think, be number one on both our lists, but my parents picked a very, very popular name for me and I’m not interested in doing that for our child, so Charlotte is a no-go.
The fridge names:
Liliana (a name he and I have liked for years and years as a hypothetical, but now feels like maybe it’s lost a bit of its sparkle for me that I’m considering using it for a real person? He still loves it.)
Penelope
Ramona
Rosalie (I love this, he is less enamored.)
TheodoraEvery time we look at the list now, we’re just not enthused. Is it decision fatigue or have we just not hit on the right option? Any help is greatly appreciated!
Thank you so much,
Jen
Wait, let’s not be too quick to give up on a name that is #1 for both of you. I can see why you’d feel that way, but the name Jennifer was its own phenomenon: no subsequent name has come ANYWHERE NEAR that level of popularity. I don’t know why I don’t jot this down so I don’t have to look it up every time, but let me see if I can find the peak year for the name Jennifer. Ah, here we go: in 1974, it was used for 4.03% of baby girls born in the United States. Additionally, the name was in the Top Ten for TWENTY-SIX YEARS IN A ROW (1966-1991), and it was #1 for FIFTEEN of those years (1970-1984), and it didn’t even drop out of the Top 50 until 2006, so the Jennifer Saturation was INTENSE and LENGTHY, making it FEEL even more popular that it was—and it was very popular.
The name Charlotte, on the other hand, has been in the Top Ten for six years, none of those years yet at #1. Its highest usage was in 2019, when it was used for .72% of baby girls. Jennifer was used at 5-6 TIMES that rate. For every FIVE TO SIX Jennifers back then, there is only ONE Charlotte now. When you were in school, I’ll bet you frequently had another Jennifer in your classroom with you, sometimes two other Jennifers. Think back: did you ever have FIVE more Jennifers with you in a single classroom? That is approximately how often there are two Charlottes in a classroom now.
Of course, those are national statistics: some locations are going to have more Charlottes than that, and in others there will be almost no Charlottes. We’ve all heard/experienced situations where someone chose, say, Juniper to avoid the popularity of Harper, and then there happened to be three Junipers and no Harpers in that grade. There were THREE Roberts (.48% usage nationally) in Elizabeth’s classroom one year, and three Josephs (.90% national usage) (all three going by Joey, and two of them having the same middle name, and a different two having the same surname initial) in Edward’s class another year: statistics are broad, and local anomalies happen. But IN GENERAL, the name Charlotte is not even in the same orbit/league as the name Jennifer—NO name is now in the same orbit/league as the name Jennifer, nor has any name come close in recent years: even extremely popular names max out at about 1/3rd-1/4th Jennifer’s usage, and for much shorter reigns.
Well. Let’s look at the other names on the list. I do think a certain level of fatigue can set in, and that you’re right that the weight of responsibility makes it harder—and especially if you’re thinking this might be The Only Name You Ever Choose. I don’t know if this will help you, but it helped me: your parental responsibility is to give her a good solid usable name. It doesn’t have to be The Best Name or The Perfect Name or the name that shines out obviously as The One. She just needs something to write on her homework papers, and for you to call out when it’s time for dinner. Think of long-ago generations of parents, who were just like “I don’t know, I guess Mary for a girl, John for a boy.” They did not sweat the way we sweat. They just picked one of the dozen or so names that were commonly used, and they went on with their lives.
All of the names are your list are good, solid, usable names; you can’t go wrong here. And I don’t see any style concerns to work through: that is, if your girl-name list were Josephine, Charlotte, Avery, and Riley, I would suggest narrowing down your style before starting the naming process, so you don’t get backed into a corner later on if you were to change your mind about having more children. But all the names on your list are of compatible/adjacent styles: even if you were to have more children, I don’t think you’re going to use Charlotte and then be having another baby and think “Oh no, none of our other girl names work with Charlotte!”
One exercise I used to narrow down my own list was to imagine the kids sitting around the dinner table, or draped around the living room. Which sorts of names feel like “my kids”? Or I would imagine giving the name at the doctor’s office, or writing it on school registration paperwork. Maybe ALL the names sound a little funny, just because it’s hard to picture theoretical kids—but some names felt more comfortable/natural than others.
Sometimes it helps to look for similar names (whatever similarity looks like to the particular parents), if only to rule them out and feel more strongly about the originals. Charlotte might lead me to Scarlet and Violet and Juliet (I remember the no J’s rule, but am including it just as part of the exercise) and Celeste; Liliana to Vivienne and Eliana and Lillian and Jillian and Lydia; Victoria to Veronica and Bianca and Catherine; Penelope to Calliope and Phoebe and Eleanor and Philippa; Ramona to Simone and Fiona; Rosalie to Rosemary and Natalie and Romilly; Theodora to Dorothea and Cordelia and Thomasina and Claudia and Georgia.
Sometimes it helps to simplify the name: Liliana to options such as Lily and Anna; Penelope to Nell and Elle; Rosalie to Rose and Leigh and Lia; Theodora to Thea. And you can play with those pieces, too: maybe you take the Anna and the Elle and it makes you think of Annabel. Or the Nell of Penelope makes you think of other names Nell can be short for, such as Eleanor. Maybe you’re thinking about how you’d like to use the nickname Lottie for a Charlotte, and that makes you think of Lettie and Etta and Hattie, and you end up considering Violet and Henrietta and Harriet. Or maybe you’re dividing Theodora, and you think of Dora but don’t want to use that, but Dora makes you think of Nora and Cora, and Cora makes you think of Clara, and so on.
Because you like Josephine and Ramona, I’d like to specifically draw your attention to the names Fiona and Simone. Both are relatively uncommon, yet easy to pronounce and spell. They both seem like they’d work well with a longer surname.
And Theodora and Liliana make me think of Lydia, which would let you still use Josephine as the middle. Lydia Josephine.
Name update:
Dear Swistle,
Liliana Josephine joined us in the wee hours of Saturday morning! We love her and her name and all the many, many nicknames she’s already inspired.
Thanks again for tackling my question!
I also wonder about the stickiness of the no Josephine rule. I guess if your family doesn’t FEEL like the kind of family that has matching initials, that might be a very hard line to cross. But Josephine is a great name, any very few people will be thinking “Oh look, there goes that family with matching initials!” In fact, she will go most of her life interacting with people that do not know both of her parents’ names. And if you like nicknames, maybe she will be Posey or Effie on the Christmas card. Or maybe you don’t do Christmas cards. Or maybe sub-optimal Christmas card cadence is a sacrifice you are willing to make. (My daughters are May & Ann. I worried a lot about how “and Ann” sounded repetitive, or that “Ann & May” sounded like anime. But I love their names individually so much, I am glad I didn’t talk myself out of it).
Since you like Rosalie and Liliana, I wonder if you would like Laurel? Nickname Lo, if you want a nickname.
Seconding all of this. Calling her Posy or Poppy or Phee or Zippy or Phina even 25% of the time dilutes the sharedness a lot. And one J kid does not mean you must use a J for any other kids. 1 is not a pattern.
One of my Great-Grandmothers was nicknamed Zippy. I don’t remember much; pretty much just her funeral, but then I was pretty little. I think she was another Elisabeth, and earned the nickname because of her personality.
This is absolutely true: “ she will go most of her life interacting with people that do not know both of her parents’ names”.
But I have to admit that I, and many others I know, would ABSOLUTELY snigger at a family of matching initials. I’m sorry, I know it’s not nice. But as long as the child/children are still living at home, this would leap out at absolutely everyone they knew and introduced themselves to. And I would think they chose Josephine not because it was pretty, but because it was on their ‘J’ list.
Thank you for making me feel so much better about naming in general. I had no idea Jennifer was such an outlier in terms of popular names, that allays a lot of my anxiety over choosing something that will give my daughter a similar experience. You’ve even given us a few options to think about that weren’t on our list – we had also tried Natalie, Georgia, Vivienne, Scarlet and Eleanor, confirming that you really have our style nailed!
I think the decision will wait until we meet her, but I do feel much more positively about the options we have. Thank you so much for taking the time to answer my questions!
Charlotte is fabulous! Familiar but not to common. Would be a great choice!
If you do go in another direction, I might suggest choosing a one- or two-syllable name since the last name will be on the long side.
Some ideas:
Rhoda (a fresh, vintage revival choice! means “rose” and is close to some of your other favored names. Rhoda Josephine has a ring!)
Thora
Vera
Estelle
As the mom of a Rosalie (often called Rosie) and three boys I thought you might benefit from our girl name list:
Georgina or Georgianna, just a little fancier than Georgia and with more nickname potential
Lorelei – While I love my 5 month old boy this name makes me wish for another girl
Phillipa – family name but who can resist Pippa
We liked Josephine but it was out once we named Rosalie (Rosie and Posey are too much for me).
I had a lot of trouble narrowing down a name for my daughter back in the spring, and it didn’t help that my friends were having babies left and right, taking potential names I might want to use! But when looking at my list, I tried to think, which name would I be truly heartbroken if a friend used? (Or which name would I just use anyway, regardless of whether a friend used it?) This helped me a ton!
I also love Rosalie and think Rosie is just about the cutest nickname there is!
I agree that all these names would be lovely – this is my favourite style by far and Josephine is my all time favorite girl’s name.
As all the names are nickname heavy I wonder if that could be the deal-breaker? Do you like one nickname more than the others? If so, id choose that name 😁.
Do you like Naomi?
Charlotte is lovely, and I am related to a little girl Charlie (just Charlie) and it’s so sweet on her. My daughter, who is almost 4 and has been in two daycares and 1 preschool, has not had a single Charlotte classmate.
I also think Matilda might work on your fridge list. It’s a very spunky name.
Oh I just posted and I realized I forgot to add: my very favorite nickname for Matilda is Maude. Swoon!
I agree Charlotte is not too popular. I only know one kid Charlotte. She’s 16 and goes by Lottie. The other two I know are in their 70s-80s.
But I like your whole list. You have a lot of good options. Ramona made me think of Beatrice (Beezus’s real name) which seems to fit in with your style. And it’s come up a few times, but I think Eleanor would be nice for you.
Also, I’m not sure you need to rule out Josephine. And is Wilhelmina (nn Mina) too out there for you?
Adelaide or Lucinda or Susannah come to mind …
I also had a popular 80s/90s name and wanted to avoid a similar fate – it’s impossible to completely avoid unless you choose a completely off the wall name, which doesn’t sound like your style. I wouldn’t worry too much about the popularity of Charlotte if you really love it. For reference my son had two girls on his soccer team this year and both were named Penelope – one went by Nellie and one Penny. Both my boys have names outside the top 100 but that are still fairly trendy when you add in the variations – so we run across their names but it’s nothing like it used to be and they think it’s fun when someone shares their name.
Charlotte and Josephine make me think of Alice, Margaret, Elizabeth, Geraldine, Felicity, Susannah, Beatrice, Cecily, Emmeline, Clementine, Claudia, Seraphine, Celeste
Does Carlotta, Charlene, Caroline, or Charity sing for you? You can get to Charlie through those if you’re not Lottie people.
So a case for name popularity. One of the biggest reasons I follow name blogs, even though I have older kids. Is the struggle I went through with naming my daughter. She is a Jessica. When she was born I thought Jessica was too popular and we had two other names ahead on the list. Sidney and Victoria. When she was born there was a Sidney and a Victoria in the nursery. I thought at least there were no Jessica’s in the nursery and it was at least unique for that day. She never had any Jessica’s in class as she has gotten older she has been in situations with other Jessica’s at work or in other social situations. She does now go by her family nickname mostly which is Jess. Which wasn’t used outside of the home growing up.
I think names are popular because they are liked by lots of people. You rarely get a what the heck where you thinking look when you introduce your children.
I sometime wonder if I worry that a popular name choice reflected that I lacked insight or creativity to do better. My kids have never had issues with their names and when we do talk about it , because they are talking of having children now, they think I am crazy to put so much thought into it.
If it were me, I’d go with Liliana Josephine. I quite like that. You could also call her Lee, if Lily or Ana don’t appeal.
Charlotte’s a good solid name, too. And as Swistle says, current popularity isn’t nearly as big an issue as it was for you Jens. My 1st grader says he doesn’t know any Charlottes.
I live in Texas and there are a lot of tiny Charlottes here, and almost universally when they go by a nickname it’s Charlie. There are also a lot of tiny girls named Charlie, Charly, Charli, and Charleigh. In my social circle the name Charles is also popular with little boys, also with the nickname Charlie, adding to risk of the name repeating in a kindergarten classroom.
That said, a few points. I had a popular name growing up and I enjoyed it. It felt like a special Sarah Club. So while you hated having a popular name, it’s possible your daughter might not?
There are a LOT of nicknames for Charlotte. I’ve personally never met a Lottie. I think Carly could work too, so if she’s in a class with another Charlotte she has options. :)
My favorite of your options is the name Josephine, and I feel like it’s not an obnoxiously matched initial family if the family is just three. I know a Josephine and she’s is a fantastic human being and it’s made me want to promote the name to anyone seeking!
I love Josephine! It’s my daughter’s name. She’s five, and we have only met one Charlotte. Of course, I also love Theodora from your list. If my daughter had gotten a little sister instead of a brother, that would have been her name!
Loving the suggestions of Lydia, Phoebe, Jillian, Claudia, Vivienne and Georgia. I do agree that both Charlotte and Josephine are still totally usable. For Charlotte, maybe going with the nn Lottie would make it feel more fresh to you both?
From your current list, I like Rosalie and Ramona best.
A few additional suggestions:
Sybil (nn Sybi)
Gwendolyn
Zella
Daphne
Eliana
Estelle
Elodie
Ivy
Margot
Noelle
Isadora
Cordelia
Felicity
I have a coworker who has a Sybil and a Paige, and I always think he needs to add a Lydia to perfect the set. In fact, I struggle to remember that Sybil is NOT Lydia.
As for the last name, I’d recommend hyphenating. My kids have a hyphenated last name and it hasn’t been too much hassle. Without the hyphen some people will read both names as surnames and alphabetize by the first one and others will read the first one as a middle name and alphabetize by the last one.
To add to Swistle’s point about popularity, my kindergartner is Elijah which was the #11 name the year he was born and is rising in popularity, so I figured there would be another one in his class. But no, the only repeated name in his class is Zoe and there are three of them! Zoe was #32 in 2014. It’s just so hard to predict!
Plus, Charlotte is a classic name whereas I think of Jennifer as a more trendy name
If you like Charlotte but want a less popular name, maybe Caroline nn Carlie?
Other ideas:
Alternative for Josephine: Genevieve
Alternative for Liliana: Eliana or Juliana
Alternative for Theodora: Aurora
My favorite is still Liliana, though. It allows for a number of nicknames: Lina, Lily, Ana, Annie and so on.
“ but let me see if I can find the peak year for the name Jennifer. Ah, here we go:…”. ❤️
Swistle, in these moments I picture you in a cozy chair by the fire, with a hot cup of tea and a big book of names on your lap like a baby-naming Mary Poppins. And it’s one of my very favorite parts of this blog!!!
Has anyone suggested Nicolette? I love that name!
Charlotte is a wonderful name. Swistle did a great job explaining the popularity issue (and how it’s not really an issue). I just asked my sons, ages 7 and 9, and neither of them know a Charlotte.
That being said, all of the names on your list are lovely. You can’t go wrong with any of them. I’m glad reading swistle’s response and all the comments has helped you feel more comfortable, I think you’re in a good position. :)
Another Jennifer here- I had 6 Jennifer’s in a college class of about 40/50 students. And my son’s preschool class of 16 had 4 Jennifer moms (we spanned 15yrs in age!). It’s such an odd phenomenon.
That being said, we named our oldest Noah 10yrs ago. Even though it was too popular. It was the name we liked. He’s only had one other Noah in his whole grade ever & she’s a girl. If you love Charlotte or Josephine- go for it!!
I think you found your next refrigerator name — Josephine. That is a great way to test your rule. I am a mom to a Josephine, named when it was outside the Top 100. She has been the only Josephine/Josie in every classroom. I wouldn’t note the parents’ initials until there were two J children. Then I would think they were likely on the Dugggar style train. Josie has also not had a Charlotte in any of her classes. The Addie/Maddy riff has been the only overdone phenomenon that has come close to the Jen/Jess hay day.
My personal favorite for you is Charlotte Josephine.
My personal popularity story: I knew 1 Liam in my two children’s elementary school careers. I know three Hudsons all born in the same year – I don’t think it was even in the top 1000 that year. You just can’t tell. If you personally know little Charlottes, then maybe not. Otherwise, I’d say go for it.
Liliana is a great choice, too.
Beautiful name! And indeed, it allows for so many nicknames :)