Hi Swistle!
We are due with our second (and last planned child) this fall. Our toddler is Ford @rthur $tew@rd. We love his name. It’s short and strong, but we do sing-song it as Fordie daily.
We’re mulling over a few options this time around and my main question is your opinion on Bernhard, nn Bern which I admit I will surely sing song into Bernie from time to time. I think the majority of the time we would call him Bern. I think Ford and Bern compliment one another well.
That being said, my concern is whether or not Bernie is too politicized… Bernhard is a (distant) family name for us, we don’t have strong opinions on Bernie Sanders one way or another but people around us do. I cringe at the possible inquiries of “like Bernie Sanders?” to which we *could* answer, “it’s a family name” and leave it at that, but it may bother me if those inquiries or associations go on for years… We are NOT the type of people that debate politics as dinner conversation and tend to avoid sharing opinions one way or another.
Other front runners are Frederick “Fritz” Murray or Murray Thomas. Middle name for Bernhard would be Thomas.
So to summarize:
Bernhard Thomas $tew@rd
Frederick Murray $tew@rd
Murray Thomas $tew@rd*Thomas and Murray are honor names for grandfathers (one deceased, one a middle name of the living) and Frederick would be in honor of our little one’s only living great grandmother as it was her father’s name. Ford @rthur was equally tied to family with each name honoring a different side of the family.
Which goes best with Ford? Is Bern too strongly associated with Bernie Sanders and if so, do you think that association will lessen over time (considering he is no longer a candidate for president and we don’t live on the east coast)?
Mostly I just love your taste in names and am curious if one of our three options makes your heart sing more than another. :-)
I think part of the package deal of Bernhard-nicknamed-Bern/Bernie is that people will have to assume you’re at least okay with the Bernie Sanders / “Feel the Bern” association. Imagine for a moment a politician you can’t stand, someone whose policies and views make you shudder with revulsion, and then imagine using a distant family name that made people say “Oh, like [that politician]?” You’d never! And so I do think using the name Bern/Bernie right now may seem to indicate a political opinion, and that “It’s a family name” won’t be enough to counteract that.
But as to how long that will persist—it’s hard to know. Sometimes after a name comes abruptly into the news we will get a big flurry of letters wondering if it’s still okay to use it—but even just a few years later the whole thing has slipped out of public consciousness. If I meet a baby named George, I don’t assume his parents are fans of the Bush administrations or the royal family, because those associations have had time to diffuse. But George is an old and traditional name with many associations including not just Bush but also Washington and Burns and Clooney and Lucas and R. R. Martin and Michael and Lopez and Gershwin and Eliot; if I met a baby named Clinton, I’d have fewer associations and would do more wondering/assuming. Bernhard/Bern/Bernie is not a name with many associations for me. And Bernie Sanders is still an active politician, and I think it’s likely we’ll continue to see him in the news as long as that’s the case. On the other hand, the man is 78 years old, and it’ll be another five or so years before your new baby is starting school. Still, if it makes you cringe to think of people making the association or making assumptions about your political opinions, I think I’d use a different name, or use Bernhard as a middle name.
Ford and Fritz is a nice pairing. I think my main concern would be that he would instead prefer to be called Fred/Freddie, and that Ford/Fordie and Fred/Freddie were too similar. I’m also finding I don’t like how many letters/sounds Ford and Frederick already share, even before taking nicknames into account. The styles of the names also feel different. I don’t know, this combination just doesn’t sit right with me; I only like it when it’s Ford and Fritz, not when it’s Ford and Frederick or Ford and Fred, and I don’t like the idea of relying on a particular nickname to make a combination work.
The one that makes my heart sing more than the others is Murray. I would be charmed to encounter that name in the wild, and I like it with Ford: another surname name, but with its own set of sounds.
I heard of a baby Murray recently and absolutely LOVED it. Murray is such a nice brother pairing with Ford. I agree that Bernie is very much associated with Bernie Sanders but it would be more of a nuisance for you in the next few years than it will be for your son as he ages and his generation identifies with new politicians.
Bernie and Ford together really emphasizes the political. I like Murray
I agree that Bern reads pretty political right now. Also, Ford and Bern (burn) are words that act as both nouns and verbs. I think Ford is great on its own, but with both together it may be a little much. One last thought is that if I encountered the name Bernhard, I wouldn’t be sure if I was supposed to pronounce the ‘h’ or not. Murray is great!
There is a child who goes to my daughter’s school who’s name is Bernhard, and he goes by Bear, which I love! Just another option, unless you’re set on Bern. Always possible for him to go by another nickname later in life once the Bern/Bernie associations die down.
Oh! Bear would work nicely!
If you can play the long game, I think there will only be a strong political association for the first 2% of his life, but I do feel like people will make the occasional comment so that might be more than you want to deal with. I’m loving the suggestion of Bear as a nickname. Ford/Bear. Fordie/Bearie/Berry. Adorable! I also love Murray.
I think the Bernie association is inevitable. And i really don’t care for Behnard and Frederick with Ford. Murray though would be so very charming. I give all my votes for Murray :)
Oh my goodness MURRAY. What a wonderful name! This one makes my heart sing as well.
I agree that Bern is potentially problematic. I LOVE the suggestion of Bear! Two other suggestions are Ben and Hardy. I know a Bernard who goes by Ben, and a Gerhard who goes by Hardy.
My immediate thought was Hardy as well! I love it! Bernhard is regal and strong, and if you love it, I’d hate to see you let it go…but I do think I would avoid Bernie.
If you’re thinking about nicknames for Murray, Mo is one option, and it goes nicely with Ford.
I think that the “Feel the Bern” elevated the names Bernie and Bern to a political slogan in a way that just a politician’s name doesn’t necessarily. I also think he will hear that phrase a lot. So, yeah, I think that’ll be a pretty strong association for awhile, and one that I wouldn’t want to deal with.
Murray is fantastic!
I agree with others about Bern/Bernie feeling unavoidably political. I also want to note – while I love a good family name, Bernhard (burn-hard) feels a bit difficult to wear.
That being said, I think Frederick “Fritz” is on point and find it very charming paired with Ford.
Ooh congratulations!
My father-in-law was John Bernard known as Ber, pronounced Bear; a nickname that melts the very cockles of my heart. Might that work for you?
I love the name Bernard too and considered it last year for my son. I loved the idea of a little Bernie (and would’ve considered Bernadette for a girl). I ultimately decided I couldn’t name him that (unable to know at that time if we would have a president Bernie potentially in the near future). We aren’t, so to me it is usable. His friends will have no idea who Bernie Sanders is. It’ll be something his friends parents occasionally bring up, and that you will probably have to deal with some questions about for the next 5 years and then I just kind of think it will be a nonissue. So I say, just go for it. If you love it, I really don’t think the temporary political association is a problem in the long run, as long as you’re okay with it being a problem in the short run.
Now, if you live in Vermont that might be a different story.
I do also love Murray. I think it’s cute and fun and wearable.
Love Murray and Fritz!! I think I’d probably avoid Bernhard at this point unless it was a middle name. I think Bern and Ford sound alright together but Bernie seems like a much more likely nickname throughout his life while I think Ford will mostly go by that vs Fordie as he gets older. And Bernie and Ford don’t sound as good stylistically IMO.
Bernie seems like a political name right now because we are in the middle of an election year and Bernie Sanders has run for the Democratic nominee twice now. But as Swistle said, he is in his late seventies. Also his name is actually Bernard. There are a lot of people who have gone by the nickname Bernie: comedians, singers, composers, actors, football players. Personally, I don’t feel like the potential Sanders/politics connection is strong enough to throw out a name you love.
You can always introduce your baby as: “This is Bernhard! But we’re calling him Bern for now.” And if someone does ask the question: “Bern… like Bernie Sanders?” Just smile and say: “Nope! Bernhard is a family name.” It takes only a few months before those you interact with on a semi-regular basis to get used to hearing you refer to your Bernhard/Bern and no longer bat an eye. And in 5 or 6 years when he goes off to elementary school, I doubt the political connection of the nickname will be as strong as it is today.
I agree with Swistle: I love Ford and Fritz together but don’t care for Ford and Frederick as much or Ford/Fred. I’m not much of a fan of Murray, though. Maybe because I have never met anyone (of any age) with that name so I’m going purely on sound as I say it out loud. Ford and Murray. Murray and Ford… I just don’t like the sound. But that is just my personal quirk.
As an aside regarding “Frederick would be in honor of our little one’s only living great grandmother as it was her father’s name,”… if some said they were honoring ME by naming their baby after MY FATHER…that would not feel like they were honoring me. Like, at all. Perhaps that is not the case with your relative – perhaps it would be interpreted as a huge honor! – but I wouldn’t recommend making that assumption unless you know for sure.
I think the hidden trump card, heh heh, is that no one other than one poster noted that Ford IS ALSO a political/presidential name. But if no one is makin g POTUS connections already…. I think that should ease your mind that Bernie won’t carry that weight forever.
But…it is a sibset that clearly leaning toward public consciousness.
Ford and Bear, though, is great!
I’m Australian and I have an association with a friend’s son named Kevin. Kevin was born in 2007, when Kevin Rudd came to office as our Prime Minister. His slogan was ‘Kevin ’07. At the time I thought she was mad to choose it as Rudd was pretty polarising and Kevin isn’t the most fashionable of names. Now though, as he is 12 years old it seems a pretty dilute association. I doubt anyone even remembers ‘Kevin ’07 when they encounter him.
My concern would actually be the two nouns in a row but you have broken that rule already so I’m assuming that is a style that you like.
Also, I love Murray. My sons watch the dreadful ‘Impractical Jokers’ and I love how they call Murray ‘Murr’ (Sounds like Mer as in mermaid). It really softens the name.
I gave my son a name that later became the name of a boy band. The band had one really popular song. After 20 years someone still references the song. I don’t know if people will say were you named for Bernie Sanders. But ‘feel the bern’ is in pop culture never to be gone.
If you love bernhard, then use it. I would vote a different nickname.
I do like Ford and Murray the best.
Not sure where you live but if it’s close to Ontario, Doug Ford is our current premier. So having a Bernie and a Ford is a little too political in my opinion, but this may not even be relevant in the USA.
I agree with Swistle, Fritz goes well with Ford (but also seems quite presidential to me), but Frederick not as much. I think it’s because Ford is quick and snappy. I of your names, I would go for Murray.
If you’re considering others, how about Redmond?
I think, unless you really hate Bernie Sanders and he is the antithesis of the vision you want to put forward about your family’s values, you shouldn’t worry about the association. First of all, Sanders is not going to be president, and although he will likely be a continuing voice in politics, he’s not going to be significantly more prominent than other senators or maybe cabinet members — and in any case, his career is not likely to last more than another 5-10 years. So I agree with others who’ve said that the worst you have to worry about is the occasional question from other adults (which, honestly, I don’t think you’re going to get as many of as you are anticipating); it’s unlikely to even occur to your son’s peers.
I don’t think “Feel the Bern” is here to stay — go ahead, name a political slogan from earlier than, say, 2008! Bern/burn puns are inevitable regardless of political associations, but that wouldn’t be a dealbreaker for me).
I also don’t think it’s such a specific and unique name that people will definitely assume you named him with a political agenda: it’s not like you’re naming him Reince or Rand or Barack or Donald. There’s also Bernie Mac! Bernie Madoff! George Bernard Shaw! Bernie the rabbit from the Annie’s mac & cheese box! I really think “it’s a family name” is enough to answer anyone’s questions, and once the people in your life come to associate the name with your son, they won’t think about Sanders (or Mac, or Madoff, or Shaw, or the rabbit) at all.
I also want to quickly point out that there’s only so much we can do to avoid name associations, since these will change significantly over our children’s lifetimes. For example, my parents named me Ruth a few years before Justice Ginsberg took the bench. There are not a lot of other famous contemporary Ruths to dilute that association, and my parents had really hated Ginsberg they probably would have kicked themselves (luckily we’re all big RBG fans, so no harm done). Conversely, if they had loved the name Geraldine but had avoided giving it to me because they didn’t like the association with VP candidate Ferraro … well, does the name Geraldine strike you as a super political name choice now? I’m guessing not.
Tl;dr: choose the name you want. Bernhard/Bern/Bernie is adorable and goes great with Ford. The political association is, in my opinion, not worth worrying about.
I agree with many commenters here saying that the correction will pass relatively quickly so if you think you can muscle through for the name you love, do it! I think Bernie and Ford is a very nice set (though I also love Kate’s suggestion of Hardy to sidestep the Sanders association!)
My concern which I haven’t seen mentioned yet is the initials B.S. (though it doesn’t seem to have done Sanders any harm!)
*connection
I agree with those that say right now it feels very political, but in a year or five or ten it will not. How many of us meeting a young man in his 20s named Ross would think of Perot? Or on meeting a boy in his late teens named Al think “he must be named after Gore”? Or a 16 year old girl named Kerry and presume her names after John? Not many, I’d wager. I know I wouldn’t.
If you love the name, and are saddened to think of not using it, go ahead and use it! You can dispel any Sanders inquiries with “it’s a family name”
But if you are not pained at the thought of not having a little Bernie, then you have plenty of other options that are equally good. For what it is worth, I really like the alliteration of Fordie and Freddie / Ford and Fred, if Fritz is not to his liking at a later date.
So basically, there are no wrong answers. He will have a handsome, rare name whichever you choose.
I think Bernhard Thomas is a great name. Also it’s cute that both brothers have names that mean “bear” (Arthur and Bernhard). Bern and Ford sound like two brothers.
I think the Bern association will fade away quickly. Bernie might take a bit more, but until then, you can call him Benny or even Berry.
About Frederick: Fred and Ford would probably get mixed up a lot, but Fritz makes it work, and there is always the nickname Rick.
Sorry, but Murray “Stuart” sounds too much like a law firm, in my opinion.
We gave our son the middle name Vernon after his living great-grandfather. For a nn, sometimes we call him Vernon, or Vern, or even Vernie. So if you like all the sounds of Bernie but want to avoid the association, I vote for Vernon! We love the middle name so much, we both have said we’d have liked that for his first name.
I agree with the others. The political association of Bern right now and for the next 10 years will be strong. “Feel the Bern” jokes will probably last longer than the politician reference because of the burn association. But that is a relatively small percentage of his life. I love the idea of Bear as a childhood nickname to get him through the first 10, then switch over to Bern later to get him through job interviews.
My firstborn’s middle name is Bernard and it’s really grown on me! It was a family name on my husband’s side, so I didn’t have a strong connection initially. But now we call him “Firstname Bear” a lot, sometimes just “Bear”, and I love it. So if you do go with Bernhard, I bet you won’t regret it! My second pick would probably be Murray. I like Fritz a lot but the z-ending would blend into the S-beginning of your last name too much for me.