Dear Swistle
We have a toddler named Edward Felix Sounds-like-silver, who goes by Teddy. I love his name so much that I still sometimes get a thrill of satisfaction thinking about it.
Our next child is due this spring and if it’s a girl our top choice is Beatrice. However I’m slightly concerned that ‘Beatrice Silver’ is too sibilant. Or that it might become Beatrissilver in speech (not sure if that’s a problem though?). Please help, I think I might be overthinking this but I can’t tell.
We also would welcome any boy name suggestions. Names I like that my partner inexplicably does not:
Rupert
Oscar
Arthur
Hugh nn HugoNames my partner inexplicably likes that I don’t:
Paul
Mark (partner is not a Christian, I’m not sure where this New Testament theme sprang from)
Allen (‘with two Ls’, ok buddy)
Callum
Andre
David
Martin
Nathan
Ray
William (I like William by itself but not with Sounds-like-silver)Any input much appreciated!
Kate x
I just said “Beatrice Silver” a dozen times out loud, and I can’t decide. Here is where I think this kind of issue falls: into the area known as It Doesn’t Really Matter At All, Unless Of Course It Matters To You. Beatrice Silver is a little sibilant, and the -ce runs into the S- a little bit. But it doesn’t make an undesirable word/phrase (such as in the famous example of Ben Dover) or cause a misunderstanding (the way, say, Liam Mason could sound like Leah Mason or vice versa). And I think what usually happens in these cases is that everyone gets accustomed to putting a pause-and-a-half between the first name and surname, instead of the usual pause: “This is Beatrice. Silver. She has a 9:00 appointment.”
My usual prescription for this sort of thing is to suggest the parents browse through a yearbook, or watch all the credits of a movie, and notice how many names fall into this same IDRMAAUOCIMTY category: it’s so many of the names! I was looking through my son’s yearbook the other day to see what a typical senior picture looks like, and I noticed name after name that has similar slight issues—and it really doesn’t matter at all. UNLESS, of course, it eternally bugs the parents, in which case it matters and they shouldn’t have done it. But my guess, my GUESS, is that that is rarely if ever the case.
We had a couple of things like this with our own kids’ names. One kid’s name blends a little with the last name to make a mildly undesirable word such as weep or sulk; I never notice it now, and no one else has ever mentioned it, and I only thought of it now when I was trying hard to think of examples. It only mattered to me during the naming process, and then never mattered again.
I just re-read and realized the surname SOUNDS LIKE Silver, so I used Blogger Privilege and went back to the email to check out the real surname, and I’d say the issue is even less with the real surname than with the stand-in: the sounds of the real surname offset the sibilance even more than the softer sounds of the stand-in.
Can you tell I want you to use the name Beatrice? I want you to use the name Beatrice. But I’m leaving room in case the -ce/S- thing really bugs you, and continues to bug you.
Okay *brisk clap*: boy names. With Edward/Teddy, nothing stands out to me from either of the two lists. It’s not at all necessary, but the FUN solution would be to find a full-name that goes with Edward, plus a nickname that goes with Teddy. Or else a name that goes well with Edward AND with Teddy. Actually, the name Paul would be pretty good for that: Edward and Paul; Teddy and Paul.
Before I start making a list, I would like to note something that seems to be happening in my area: the return of Older Nicknames. Do you remember in the 1990s when suddenly Sam and Max and Charlie and Joe started sounding fresh an in old-man kind of way? It’s almost hard to believe those names used to sound impossibly old-mannish/old-fashioned/stodgy, but they DID, and I REMEMBER when they did. And then they started to sound amusingly quirky, the kind of name you might give a dog, or might CONSIDER for a child but in a humorous, counter-culture kind of way (“What if we just name him MAX? or JOE?” “Honey, come on, you have to HELP with this”). And shortly after that, everyone was looking for long forms of those names so they could use them for their kids. And now they’re just ordinary names.
We have also recently been through a stage of No Nickname Required or Desired, where parents say things like “We want to name him William—but will people call him Billy?” and “We want to name her Elizabeth—but will people call her Beth?” and we have had to say again and again that not only can a kid get away without a nickname in this particular time period (in a way they COULDN’T, really, when some of us were growing up), but even if they DID get a nickname it certainly would be Will or Ellie rather than Billy or Beth.
ANYWAY, my point is that I have been hearing the next wave of Nickname Revival: names such as Johnny, Billy, Marty, Mickey, Pete, Tommy. The nicknames parents were avoiding are starting to come back into style. Most tellingly, some of my kids’ classmates are nicknaming or re-nicknaming themselves: a Charlie now wants to be known as Chuck; a Thomas wants to be known as Tommy; a Jack now goes by Johnny. Before long we may be receiving letters from parents saying “We want to name him William—but we don’t want him called Will or Liam” and “If we’re going to call him Billy anyway, should we just name him that?”
Now that you will understand why I am putting James/Jimmy on the list rather than James/Jamie:
Albert/Bertie
August/Gus
Charles/Charlie/Chip
Desmond/Desi
George
Harvey
Henry
James/Jimmy
John/Johnny/Jack (too Kennedy with Teddy?)
Oliver/Ollie
Phillip/Pip (possibly too whimsical with surname)
Robert/Robbie (I’m not quite ready for Bobby, but I believe it’s on its way)
Wesley/Wes
Name update:
Hello Swistle! Baby Boy Sounds-like-silver was born this Saturday. We’ve named him Albert Ernest (“Albert” isn’t quite as bold a choice here in the UK as it would be in the US) and are calling him Al. Thank you to you and the commenters for your help!
Jacob/Jake
I have an Edward/Teddy! Seems much less common than Theodore. My Teddy’s brother is Holden, which doesn’t really match in that there’s no nickname. I also like Whitman/Whit with Teddy. And Swistle’s suggestion of Wesley/Wes.
Any chance you would like Beatrix just as much as Beatrice? It cuts down a bit on the sibilance.
When you said you had an Edward/Teddy, I immediately thought James/Jimmy (which is also one of my brothers names) We have a Richard who goes by Ricky which could also work well for you. Edward and Richard, Teddy and Ricky, Ted and Rick. You could also do Richie if you don’t like Ricky. I’m not entirely sure that Dickey is ready to come back although the Nick show Nicky, Ricky, Dickey and Dawn has made it seem much more normal. Which brings to mind Nicholas. Edward and Nicholas, Teddy and Nicky, Ted and Nick.
Beatrice also reminds me of the name Bridget which I find charming and which has no s sound at the end.
I would also add to the list:
Andrew (Teddy & Andy)
Anthony (Teddy & Tony)
Alexander
Christopher
Conrad (Edward & Conrad sound great together, bu I can’t think of a good nickname?)
Frederick
Gregory
Jeremy
Julian
Lucas
Lucian
Morgan
Roland
Sebastian
Zachary
(From your list, my fovourite is Arthur!)
And as for Beatrice, I don’t find it particularly tongue-twisting, but here are some alternatives that I like:
Eleanor (my favourite! – Edward & Eleanor, Teddy & Elly or Teddy & Nora, Eleanor Silver)
Victoria (Teddy & Vicky or Teddy & Tori, Victoria Silver – I really like this one too!)
Anna
Annabel
Alexandra
Adeline
Clara
Eliza
Irene
Isadora
Matilda (Teddy & Tilly)
Penelope (Teddy & Penny!)
Rosalind (Teddy & Rosie)
Valerie
Oooh! I really like the idea of Teddy & Jules/Julian.
It seems like you really like Kings-of-England names, and your husband really likes Biblical names (which can also read as classic-Amercan-everyman names…early American colonists used Biblical names a lot). Which isn’t a super useful insight because it doesn’t actually give you a name to fall back on…except for John and James. Have you considered John or James?
Just underplay King John. He deserves it, that nutter.
There were Davids among the Kings of Scotland, and he’s Biblical too. David and Edward have a nice symmetry to my ear without being too matchy.
I wanted to add Henry/ Hank
Bertram/ Bertie
I’m trying to think outside the box for a name that is a little royal and a little biblical and a little middle of the road. I came up with Philip and Simon. Where you could get “fun” though is nicknames. What about Philip nicknames Philo (rhymes with hi-lo) or Simon nicknamed Simo (Seemo). You’re lucky that Teddy is already more than a shortened form of Edward because it lets you get unusual on the nicknames for your second. The same would work for Frederick, if you used Fritz as the nickname and not Freddy. Teddy and Fritz sound like best friends.
I do think you are overthinking the Beatrice Silver thing. Even after reading your question and repeating the name to myself, it took a couple of minutes before I figured out what the possible issue could be. I found that I just naturally put enough pause between first & last that I never noticed. Another thing to consider is if you plan to use a nickname for Beatrice. Bea Silver would totally eliminate the issue in most situations (not that I really think it’s an issue with Beatrice.)
I love Teddy! I think I would really want to find a longer name with a similar nickname-though I realize my desire for complimentary siblings names is higher than other people’s. August/Augustus-Auggie/Gus & Wesley/Wes are my favorites from Swistle’s list. I do like James, but lean more towards the nickname Jamie for you. In my neck of the woods, I see a lot of Jimmy’s still and even more just James-so Jamie is the one that feels more fresh/retro to me. Sebastian/Baz, Andrew/Drew/Andy, Charles/Charlie, Samuel/Sam/Sammy, Everett/Rhett, Isaac/Ike. Names without an obvious nickname that I think could work include Felix, Myles, Milo.
Looking at your lists, Callum jumps out at me from your husbands. I like Cal, though Cal/Calvin seems more similar to the names on your list-maybe this could work as a compromise name?
Nickname Revival and/or Unusual Alternates might be my favorite thread topics ever. My additions (and seconds):
Charles/Chet (swooooon) or Cal or Hal
Isaac/Ike
Christopher/Kit
James/Jem
Michael/Mick
Philip/Flip
Andrew/Drew
Francis/Finn
Patrick/Patch
Isaiah/ Izzy
Silas/ Sy
I think Beatrice (Not Quite) Silver is fine. I’d keep it.
For a boy, I like the first commenter’s suggestion of Jacob/Jake. John and James were other good suggestion, with plenty of potential nicknames.
From your partner’s list, if you don’t like Andre, how about Andrew with the nickname Andy or Drew? Teddy & Andy and Teddy & Drew both sound good. Or instead of Nathan, how about Nathaniel/Nate? (Though that one would depend on how much like Silver the surname is.)
Or how about Jonathan/Jon?
We considered naming our son Edward and calling him Teddy! We ended up naming him James (and call him James but I think Jamie or Jimmy would work well with Teddy). Another name we considered was Albert nicknamed Bertie or Albie. This is my favorite for you! I also like your choice of Arthur but I’m not sure I’m a fan of Artie. Other names we considered were George and William (nn Wilkie-not sure if it’s a legitimate nickname or not but we liked it). Beatrice is perfect and I wouldn’t worry about the last name issue at all.
Henry nn Harry (Like Prince Harry).
Oliver nn Ollie
Christopher nn Kit
Thomas nn Tom
Jonathan nn Jonty
Tobias nn Toby
Barnaby nn Barney
Jasper nn Jaz
Benjamin nn Benji
Jasper reminded me of Casper: Edward & Casper, Casper Silver, Teddy & Perry, Ted & Cas… It sounds good, but I’m wondering – is the “friendly ghost” association still holding strong?
I come to vote for Beatrix to cut down on the S sound :)
Love Beatrice, but if the potential sound issue ends up being a deal breaker, I think these would be great choices:
Margot
Daphne
Phoebe
Annabel
For a boy, I love Peter, George, Milo, Graham, Everett or Charles for you. From Swistle’s list, I think James or Oliver are my favorites.
Teddy’s brother could be Joey! Edward and Joseph, Teddy and Joey, Ted and Joe.
What about Christopher nicknamed Kit? Teddy and Kit?
If you like the suggestion of Nicolas the nickname could be Cole instead of Nicky.
Go with Beatrice!
We also plan to name a boy Edward nn Teddy and find any other boy names difficult to agree on.
Edward nn Teddy and
Henry nn Hank
Sebastian
Alden (Neil Armstrong’s middle name)
Solomon (I wonder if it could be stretched to nn Saul or Sully.)
I associate Teddy with bear. Would you like a name that also nods to that association like Arthur or Barrett?
I find this trend interesting. I guess many teenagers go through a stage of reinventing themselves and finding a new nickname is a very safe option to do that. Kind of the modern equivalent of what we did in the 80s – “Stop calling me Kathy, my name is Kate now”. Both of my sons have assigned themselves nicknames from the right hand side column of Swistle’s list so I think she is spot on. Also, my son’s best friend has a modern surname name which I think is really on trend… and calls himself Brad. LOL.
Do you like Richard, Stephen or Vincent all have that Tudor/80s vibe to me… or maybe Thomas?
Beatrice! Definitely Beatrice. I think it’s sounds nice together. Like a daring character in a novel.
For boys, I think that Arthur and Callum from your respective lists are the closest in style. From Swistles list my favorite is Charles/Chip. Teddy and Chip?! I can’t even handle that.
I love the suggestion of Frederick, nn Fritz. Teddy and Fritz are so so lovely together and Edward and Frederick are great too—but you do run the “Ed and Fred” risk there.
I like Alexander (Xan, or Xander) and Jude (no nickname, I just think it might work style wise). I also like think Reuben (Ben!) might be a good fit.
A good way to solve the sound issue regarding Beatrice is just choosing a nickname: Bree, Trixie, Betty, Birdie, Betsy.
For a boy, I like Benjamin/Benny, Henry/Hank, Louis/Louie, Nicholas/Nick.
I would say go with Beatrice. It is fine with your last name.
I like the names on your list better than those on your husbands but, alas, it is necessary to find something you both like.
Some other names like that:
Gregory (Rory) – Edward and Gregory (Teddy and Rory)
Nicholas (Cole) – Edward and Nicholas (Teddy and Cole)
Raymond (Ray) – Edward and Raymond (Teddy and Ray)
Luther (Luke) – Edward and Lither (Teddy and Luke)
Go with Beatrice!
August for a boy
August and Edward
Gus and Teddy 😍