Hello Swistle!
Long time reader, first time writer!
Before we were married, my husband and I agreed on a couple of things as far as naming our children went: 1) Middle names would be meaningful/honorific names, as both of our middle names are family names; 2) First names would be their own, and have little/no tie to family members, unless it was absolutely something we loved; and 3) My family names would take slight precedence, since I added on/go by his surname and, with three sisters and only female cousins on my father’s side, my surname will likely not be continuing on. My husband told me soon after that he would actually prefer that we use my two grandmothers’ names as middle names for any daughters, since he considers them his grandmothers too, and loves them very much.
That leads to now. I’m elated to write that I’m pregnant with my first child, a little girl! First girl for either side of our family in 15 years. My much-adored grandmother, Patricia “Pat,” passed away unexpectedly only a few months before I became pregnant, so middle name is a no-brainer, non-negotiable for us. We also don’t like changing the names, so using Patrice or some other variant is a no. We briefly considered using Anne, her middle name, but it doesn’t feel as special or connected to her.
However, Patricia is not exactly the easiest middle name to work with. I am waffling between trying to find something that sounds GREAT with Patricia (that we also LOVE), and saying “forget it!” and just using what we love regardless of how it sounds. I know, realistically, that most people won’t be familiar with their friends/co-workers/acquaintances middle names, so it’s probably more important to focus on how the first sounds with the surname, but I am a Name Nerd, capital-Ns, and it’s proving more difficult than I’d have hoped. I tend to like a lot of longer names that end in -a or -ia, and visually it’s very unappealing to me to repeat that, even if it sounds okay aloud. Add to that, a lot of other names I like end in S or R sounds, and our surname is Swiss-German, sounds kind of like “tuber” with a hard Z/S, so some of the combinations run into each other or just sound so clunky… I’m just a little stuck. I am even thinking about throwing Rule #3 out and using Patricia as a first name, but I am also having a hard time with that, because I’m not crazy about the nicknames, and losing her is still very fresh, and my husband’s best friend is a male “Pat.”
I would LOVE some new suggestions, or just your thoughts on our favorite names. I feel like I’ve seen everything and still none of these feel like a great fit. Right now we are calling the baby Potato (get it? Tuber?).
Our names so far are:
Antonia
Ariadne
Coral
Eve
Florence
Francine
Frida
Gloria
Gwendolyn
Harriet
Imogen
Ingrid
Iris
Juliet
Juniper
Lilac
Lucille
Marigold
Minerva
Nadine
Opal
Phoebe
Roxanne
Sabrina
Tabitha
Veronica
Names that have been vetoed because they are too popular, a close relation, or my husband dislikes:
Amelia
Cleo (he says it’s too Miss Cleo)
Clementine
Cordelia
Bernadette
Dahlia
Edith
Fern
Hazel
Ione
Josephine
Lavender
Luna
Margot
Paloma (initials PP–my husband hasn’t said anything so far about Phoebe, and yes, he knows how it’s spelled, but he HATES these initials. Do you think this is a problem? I’m torn.)
Pearl (initials PP)
Persephone (PP)
Ramona
Rose and all Rose variations (hurts my heart because Rosemary was one of my favorites, but I understand my husband’s reasons)
Ruby
Winifred
Winter
Violet
My husband has a well-known, Hebrew/Biblical name that has no nicknames. I have a long, feminine, ancient Greek/Roman name with a million nicknames, and I go by a unisex nickname with most people. We tend to like nature names and older, well-known names, that are either long with easy, intuitive nicknames, or have few/no possible nicknames (just like our names). We slightly prefer the versatility of nicknames, but it’s not a necessity. Had this baby been a boy, my front-runners were Fox, Adam, Ignatius, and Malcolm, with about 25 other options waiting in the wings. We plan on hopefully having three to four kids, and, if we have another girl, her middle name will be Olive.
Thanks in advance for any input!
Mama Tuber
I first zeroed in on Minerva: it’s very high on my own Sorry I Can’t Use It list, and I just love it, and I think it’s great with Patricia. But I love it less with the surname; I think it’s the repeated -er- sound: Minerva Tuber. My tongue twists around it.
It’s hard for me to narrow down the list because I think such a large percentage of them are really good (especially since I don’t share your dislike of the look of two names in a row ending in -a), but some that seem particularly good to me are Florence, Gwendolyn, Marigold, and Sabrina. And I’d bring Cordelia, Josephine, and Winifred back from the veto list, if I had that power.
Harriet Tuber brings Harriet Tubman to mind, but that’s a very positive association and also I’m not sure if your surname actually begins with Tub-.
I too avoid P.P. initials. They’re not out of the question, and I can imagine loving a name so much I would consider them—but since you are planning more children, I would save the P names for when you’re not using a middle name starting with P.
I would take Ruby off the list: to my ear the almost-rhyme is a little comical with the surname. Ruby Tuber. I would remove Juniper Tuber for similar reasons. (Luna Tuber and Winter Tuber are already off the list, or else I would remove them as well.)
I doubt I will be adding anything you haven’t already considered, but here are a few that came to mind when I was looking at other names on your list:
Felicity
Fiona
Genevieve
Georgia
Henrietta
Maxine
Millicent
Simone
I notice you have some groups of names on the lists that, if you were to use one name from the group, it’s possible you’d feel it ruled out using others in the group. For example, if you used one color name (Violet, Lavender, Lilac, Hazel, Coral, etc.), would that mean you would not want to use any of the others? If you used one plant name (Iris, Juniper, Lilac, Marigold, Dahlia, Fern, Hazel, etc.), would that rule out the others for you? If you used Opal, would that rule out Pearl? It is good to think through such things ahead of time, so you can be sure you’re choosing your top choice from any group that would be eliminated once one name was chosen.
Name update:
I’m updating sooner than I thought I would because our little girl arrived unexpectedly early! After 36 hours of labor, I was absolutely exhausted and could hardly think about names. My husband initially wanted Juniper, which I love, but when I looked at her, it didn’t feel right. I suggested Phoebe again, which despite the somewhat unfortunate initials, was the only name that really stuck with me. My husband immediately agreed she was a Phoebe, and Phoebe Patricia was welcomed to our family. Thanks for all the advice and input from all the readers!
I rather like Roxanne Patricia, Coral Patricia, and Francine Patricia.
I did have another thought though. What about using Pat as the middle name. I think several of your preferred names work well with a single syllable middle name.
i love Gwendolyn Pat Tuber. I also really like Veronica Pat Tuber and Minerva Pat Tuber.
I’d use the graduation ceremony test to see what you love best, and also to release your anxiety about a longer name. For example, say in an extremely grand and congratulatory voice
“GWENdolyn PatRICIA TUber”
I think you’ll find that they’re all lovely, and maybe one will rise to the top!
How about Flora? I think that would be marveouls with Patricia!
Flora Patricia Tuber
Love it!
I have a special place in my heart for Patricia because it is the name of my deceased sister. While we called her Patty there are other nicknames that might work better for you. I know several Patricia’s that go by Trish or Trisha. I even grew up with a Patricia that went by Tiki. Baby Name Wizard shows possible nn’s of Pixie, Riki, Trixie and Pip along with many others. So if you love the name and the only hold up is the nn, that’s easy to fix. Patricia Eve or Patricia Lucille are two of my favorites from your list. You can tell your daughter you named her after someone you loved and you were sure to include a name of her own that you also love so that if she wanted to she could go by that one when she was older.
I think my original comment failed to post :(
I happily proffer Anna Patricia Tuber as a solution. We South Americans tend to use double names (just not in the American way which can seem more disjointed to my ear) — so there are plenty of Andres Felipe, Jose Andres, Pedro Nel, Maria del Mar, Luisa Fernanda, etc. So, when I saw that the grandmother was Patricia Anne, I immediately thought of flipping it.
It has a ton of pros:
1. Easy in more than one language
2. Ton of nicknames – and Anna can be used alone or as Anna Patricia.
3. Serious, elegant name that is not stuffy
4. Full honor name
5. Works in every scenario
I’d second this. Anna Patricia Tuber is the first name I’ve read thus far that just easily flows off the tongue from start to finish. It’s lovely.
I really think you’ve got some great names on your list, and quite a few that work just fine with both Patricia and the last name. Like Swistle, I’m not particularly bothered by the repeated “a” or “ia” endings, but since you don’t care for them, I will try to keep that in mind as I review your list.
My top picks for you are Florence, Gwendolyn, Harriet & Juliet. I agree that something with 3+ syllables flows quite well with Patricia. I’ll also suggest Genevieve & Vivian.
I would also avoid the PP initials. I don’t think it would be the end of the world, but you really do have several lovely names. It seems like it would be an easy thing to avoid. Instead of Phoebe, I wonder what you think of Chloe and Zoe?
I would name her Mary Patricia Tuber. Maybe she would want to be called Mary Pat, maybe she wouldn’t. But I think it’s perfect.
There are lots of Mary variants, too. My favorite is Miriam. Miriam Patricia Tuber.
I have a mad love for the name Antonia. So lovely and rarely used.
My daughter’s middle name is Patricia, after her great grandmother. I agree it’s hard to find a first name that flows well. Patricia is a great first name, but doesn’t have the easy rhythm of more common middle names.
Anyway, I’m not advising you one way or another, but if it makes you feel better we just picked a name we loved instead of focusing on flow. Her name is a little clunky, but it works in a pinch!
Mama Tuber here! I’m starting to lean that way. That or throw out my whole list and start from scratch! Nothing is fitting.
Our “name lists” overlap soooo much! So clearly I love all of your choices. I especially love Florence, Gwendolyn, Francine, Ingrid and Harriet with Patricia. I think it’s the repeating “r” that does it for me in most of those. I also get very swoony for the name Felicity, Swistle’s suggestion. And Genevieve flows so well to me too.
I would like to add to the contenders pile Evangeline and Margaret.
Congratulations and definitely provide us with an update!
I may be in the minority but I don’t think the first and middle initials matter all that much so PP doesn’t matter much. Most people use their first and last, or first middle last. I don’t think I’ve ever had a reason to use my first and middle initials. So if her name was Phoebe Patricia Tuber, she would sometimes initial things as PT or PPT but never PP.
I’d second this. PP (or any other variant of two initials I didn’t like together) would only bother me if it was a first and last name. First and middle seem very inconsequential to me.
I haven’t convinced my husband yet but happy to see someone else feels this way! My front-runner was definitely Phoebe till he expressed distaste for the initials.
Mama Tuber
Loving Ariadne Patricia Tuber. You could use Ari, Ree, or Addie as nicknames, or even Pat.
That is a stunning combo!!
Also –
Daphne Patricia Tuber
Katerina Patricia Tuber
Alice Patricia
I love Gwendolyn Patricia so much!!! I love Josephine Patricia, too, but I see that that one’s out. Juliet Patricia is also very nice. I like Lucille and Patricia, but together they seem a little too mid-century to me. Would you consider Adelaide Patricia or Adele Patricia?
I think Gwendolyn Patricia and Imogen Patricia work very well! How about Alice or Annabelle?
Imogen, Eve and Juliet are my favorites from your list.
Evangeline or Genevieve with the nickname Eve/Evie would be lovely and both sound great with the middle name Patricia.
Anna Patricia was a great suggestion.
What about Caroline, Isobel or Adeline?
Elizabeth Patricia perhaps?
All the best!
Oh! What about Elodie? Such a pretty name.
Elodie Patricia. Love!
Seconding Elodie. I like it a lot with Patricia.
I think you should definitely use Patricia as a middle name. I agree with the above poster about saying the name out loud, like at a high school graduation. Patricia has a great sound and has a wonderful meaning for you and your daughter. Go for it!
I used two family middles for my youngest daughter. It’s a little clunky (and I don’t think Patricia is clunky at all!) but I love having those names in there. Really very important, much more so than the better, more flow-y sounding names we were considering in the middle.
You have such lovely choices. I’m actually kind of drawn to the combos where the first name and the middle name end in “a”: Minerva Patricia, Antonia Patricia, Flora Patricia, Anna Patricia, etc. How about Laura? But really, I don’t think you can go wrong!
My SIL is Patricia..Trish,Trishy,Trisha – all of which are perfectly lovely in a woman of 40+ but I think for a millennial Patricia;- Trixie or Cia (seea) sound more current if you chose to use it as a first name.
I love Harriet and Phoebe from your list
Nadine Patricia!!
Wow!
Yes!
Genius!!
I like Patricia nn “P”! I like Ariadne and Imogen best w Patricia and Tuber.
Ariadne Patricia gets my vote.
FWIW, my middle name is Patricia (after my mom’s mother, who died long before I was born). I do not like the overall rhythm/cadence of my full name, but I so deeply appreciate having the name of this woman I would have loved to have known. It’s very, very “worth it” to me.
I would say that rhyming first and middle is trending with a capital T – I know a bunch of little girls with a first name and middle name that both end in A, including my own daughter. I love the rhythm of it and think it is beautiful! And as Eleanor from British Baby Names says, it is very Edwardian, e.g. early 1900s :) Some examples she pulls out from that time period include Martha Bertha and Aurelia Amelia (links below)
http://www.britishbabynames.com/blog/2012/04/7-ways-to-create-an-edwardian-baby-name.html
http://www.britishbabynames.com/blog/2011/05/alliterative-edwardian-siblings.html
I thought of Millicent and then saw Swistle suggested it. Millicent Patricia sounds very pleasing to my ear and I like it with your surname. I will also suggest Esther.
So many lovely contenders I wonder if you can narrow down to a category you would see a sib set coming from?
Opal, Lilac, Winter
Nadine, Roxanne, Gwendolyn
Antonia, Francine, Lucille (or Lucia)
Sabrina, Tabitha, Veronica (which all 3 I kind of love)
Ariadne, Minerva, Imogen
Juliet, Eve, Phoebe
I agree an honor middle needn’t be a “perfect” fit because the love will be there every time you use it. But the Sabrina, Tabitha, Veronica set seems fresh and romantic to me for a trio of (possible) little girls!
Patricia is a long name with strong consonant sounds, so my suggestion is another strong/longish name to balance it out. For me, names like Eve and Iris sound too gentle/simple when paired with Patricia, even though they are beautiful names.
I understand the reluctance to repeat the “a” ending but I think it really works in several cases, especially Sabrina Patricia Tuber. This name looks and sounds so balanced and harmonious to me! Swistle’s suggestion of Georgia also works to my ear for similar reasons: Georgia Patricia Tuber.
Other suggestions to add to your list of possibilities.. I keep feeling like a name starting with B, F, D or V would give the first name the gusto it needs to hold up to Patricia’s sounds:
– Felicity Patricia (per Swistle)
– Florence (Flora) Patricia
– Bellamy Patricia
– Birdie Patricia
– Briony Patricia
– Daphne Patricia
– Dorothy/Dorothea Patricia
– Delphine Patricia
– Daisy Patricia
– Vivian/Vivienne Patricia
– Valerie Patricia
Or what about a first name Beatrice (nickname Bea)? Was about to suggest this, but too close to Patricia’s sounds…perhaps this could be an adapted honor name for Patricia?
My vote’s for Patricia in the first name slot. It’s so bold and unusual at this point, and there are so many nicknames besides Pat. An earlier commenter listed many of them, but I’m particularly fond of Pixie or Tricia (spelled that way, not Trisha).
I also encourage you to read some of the names announced at http://announcements.telegraph.co.uk/births. The dominant trend in them are long, slightly awkward first name-doubel middle name combos that seem to clearly be honor names. The result are names like “Edina Frances Elizabeth” or “Alice Katharine Benetta” or “Cleopatra Frederica Madeline” (all real examples, though I pulled them from http://www.britishbabynames.com ). These are very “posh” and have all kinds of mixed-bag connotations in a British context, but I find the off-kilterness of the combos, in terms of sound, to be really refreshing. You can tell they were chosen with intent for their meaning. After reading these for awhile, a combination like, say, Minerva Patricia Lilac, is very appealing!
I am Laura Patricia! I love the way the two “A’s” at the end go together. Patricia is a great middle name :)