Hi Swistle!
My husband and I are expecting our first baby in mid June. We’re both from large families and are hoping for around 6 of our own.
We’re fairly traditional in terms of taste in names, but like the more unused classics. I’d say that our theme is “British Parliament:” names that sound like they could belong within old, established English families. Our last name is English/Scottish and rhymes with Eaves, starting with R.
The problem is that we’d like to name the baby after my husband, if he’s a boy. His name is Tyler James, and though I’m okay with having a junior, I’m having trouble deciding what to call him so he’ll fit in with the names we’d like to give future children (i.e. a brother named Winston). Tyler is too ’90s to me, not to mention confusing around the house but I’m not a big fan of calling him James, because of a negative association and because of the double S sound when you add in our last name. I’d be okay with nicknames for James, just not TJ or JT.
Would love your thoughts and advice- chances are, even if this baby is a girl, we’ll run into our “junior” situation one day!
All the best,
Madeleine
The more I work on baby-naming questions and issues, the more I notice that SO MUCH of choosing names boils down to making choices that eliminate other choices. On one hand, of course that’s what it boils down to: when you choose one name, you are not-choosing all the others. But it took me a long time to realize that the same thing happens with preferences, and with style categories, and so forth: certain choices rule out other choices.
Your letter is an excellent example: you want to use traditional/British/classic names, AND you want to have a junior, AND you want sibling names to coordinate. Because your husband’s name is a modern surname name and not at all traditional, British, or classic, something’s got to go: the three preferences can’t all be met. You can have a junior, and also give the rest of your children British Parliament names, if you give up the preference for sibling-name coordination. Or you can have sibling-name coordination and British Parliament names, if you give up the preference of having a junior. Or you can have sibling name coordination and a junior, if you give up the preference for British Parliament names. The trick is to choose which element of the three is least important to you.
Doesn’t that sound simple? But we know it isn’t, not at all. For one thing, the desire for a junior may not be evenly spread between you. You mention that “we’d” like to name the baby after your husband, but then you say you’re “okay with” that. So it may be that of the three elements that can’t co-exist, your husband would rank “having a junior” as most important, and you would mark it as least important.
The proposed solution seems to be to give your husband a junior—but then never call the child by any of his own names, because those names are not your style and/or have negative associations. This is where I start to ask just how important it is to have a junior, and WHY it is so important: at the point where you are giving a child names you don’t like and won’t use, the price of having a junior seems too high for the value received. At some point I think the line needs to be drawn: “We wanted this, and under different circumstances we could have had it, but in these actual circumstances it is not going to work even if we try to force it. It is sad, but there it is.”
It is probably increasingly clear that my own vote for least-important element is the junior. But if there is no getting around that, then my vote is to name him Tyler James and call him James. James goes just fine with names such as Winston: it may be plainer and/or more common than you’d prefer, but the style coordinates and doesn’t clash. The concern about the repeating S sound seems so minor compared to the other issues at stake here, I think it’s a well-worthwhile trade: a minor preference abandoned so that you can keep all three major ones.
Only you know if you can get past the negative association you have with the name James. But it seems to me that if you don’t like the first name and you have a negative association with the middle name, that brings us back to the idea that sadly it is just not going to work to have a junior in this situation. Perhaps your husband could be mollified by using Tyler as the middle name for one child and James as the middle name for another.
Name update:
Hi Swistle,
You (and your incredible readers!) helped us out on your December 28th ’15 post. We had our baby boy on June 21st and named him Tyler James. So far he’s being called Jay and James and we’re both happy with our choice!
You eloquently explained the issue of conflicting preferences in names and led us to some meaningful discussions for priorities in naming our brood, so thank you for that. We are also planning on using some of the terrific suggestions for names in the comments for future kids, so thanks to all!
Madeleine
I like Tyler James, but I kind of hate naming kids after their parents as a general rule, so I’m biased here. I’m a vote for scrapping the junior. I would consider using Tyler as a middle; or Tyler as the first and giving the kid a middle name that you love, that you can use day to day. By using Tyler as the first name and using the middle name that you love, you still get a son named after his father and you get the name you like in the middle.
Congratulations and best wishes!
I think forgoing a junior is probably the best bet, too, but if you do name him Tyler James, I think James would work fine with your imagined family. And Jamie is cute for a little boy.
Would Seamus give you the break you want from negative associations with James? Although I guess that doubles down on the too many S sounds problem. Maybe you’d like Jay or Jamie? (Jamie Eaves is extremely British Parliament).
But I’m definitely in favor of only feeling constrained to having a junior if that’s what you want to do.
My first thought was to call him Jamie, which I believe is a good Scottish name, and would go great with Eaves. I also think James Eaves sound just fine.
Nail on the head, Swistle.
This is perfect advice.
I agree that you should forgo the junior.
Oh, Swistle, on the money as always.
The junior situation really seems… Forced? I don’t want to be harsh! I come from a family of juniors and seniors and family names! But in this case, the name isn’t your style, you don’t/can’t use the middle name, AND initial nicknames options are meh at best.
If the junior aspect is the most important or second important, I do wonder if you might like Jim or Jimmy or Jem as a nn. Jem strikes me as particularly British, but I could be wrong.
Jake as a nickname for James?
I am less bothered by the James repeating “S” sound than the bleeding together of Tylerreaves. Tyler Eaves? Tyla (R)eaves? Hmm. I think Swistle’s suggestion of using the names in the middle is a good one. Another example– our son’s name is Ian, and his father’s name is Brian (last three letters= Ian). Maybe you can find a different way to honor the father without having a junior? Same initials?
Agree with Swistle that letting go of the Junior is probably the best way to go.
If you decide to go with Tyler, maybe this little fact from our family will help you feel better in your own mind. My mother’s maiden name is Tyler and her roots are all English. It is an old English surname that goes back many generations. So – although it feels modern as a first name, you could tell yourself the story that it is an old, classic surname-as-firstname – which it is. Reframing it may mollify you if you (your husband?!?) decide to go the Junior root. Cold comfort, perhaps! It doesn’t change everyone’s perception of Tyler, but it may help you smooth over in your own head the potential style clash.
Best of luck.
James R…s sounds fine to my ear! Yes, a little repetitive, but not in a negative way. It has a regal sound, and like another commenter pointed out, actually easier to say than Tyler R..s.
I think you should use the junior and call him James or Jamie.
Or, you could switch the names around: James Tyler. Not technically a junior anymore, but still honoring his father.
I like an earlier commenter’s “honor through initials” idea and suggest Trevor Jude as a sweet British-y boys name that connects him to his dad.
How about James James Morrison Morrison Weatherby George Dupree, if you want to go REALLY British? No, just kidding. I love the name James. Jake is a good suggestion for a nickname, and I like Jem, too.
Jims is a darling nickname for James. But it is awkward with “Eaves”. Jem is a fantastic nickname. It might read ‘Jem and the Holograms’ to you, though.
I think that having a larger family gives you a lot of leeway, styles often change over time and some siblings co-ordinate better than others.
I think having an outlier won’t cause any comment if that outlier is a junior. My pick though would be James Tyler *eaves. I think it sounds great and should keep dad happy. My James prefers his full name but I called him Jiminy when he was a baby :)
For nicknames for a junior you could go for Deuce or Chip (as in chip off the old block). Some cute alternatives if a junior is a must. You could also call him by his last name alone, I think your last name is great!
Would you be ok with a longer version of James instead? I think Jameson is great and old fashioned. Or perhaps you could alter the whole name slightly to match your tastes more. Something like Tynan Jameson or Tybalt Jameson. A stretch maybe but I know these sort of alterations are becoming popular among celebrities and I wouldn’t be surprised if they became more common.
Don’t make him a junior. I always feel bad for the other ki who didn’t get the parents name and wonder if they feel less special. I also think it’s super confusing.
I do love all kids to have a namesake. So I’m always over incorporating name sakes and meaning into names. Having a story or a person incorporated into the name.
I think the compromise would be to either use one name as the middle and just pick a first name you like and then use the other name you didn’t use as a middle for another further son.
I personally love James Tyler R………s. I think it sounds very British and classic and James will work with many other names and not limit you in naming style in future.
If you can’t get over James I would suggest Jameson Tyler R……..s
I would love to see a list of potential names that you guys like and see more what your style is and potential names that would go with your style.
Forgo the junior. Use Jamie Tyler instead. It pays homage to your husband but meets your other criteria as well.
What about using Tyler James as a double middle name?
I really like;
George Tyler James (R)eaves
Albert Tyler James (R)eaves
Neville Tyler James (R)eaves
Percy Tyler James (R)eaves
In my family, repeat of names are incredibly common, through juniors and thirds and fourths, etc. What’s happened in both my immediate and extended families that’s worked well is using initials. For instance, my father’s line looks like this, with pseudonyms:
1st: Andrew Nicholas, goes by Andrew/Andreas
2nd: Andrew Nicholas Jr., goes by Nicholas
3rd: Adam Nicholas, goes by Adam; Andrew Benjamin (Benjamin first name of other grandfather, who goes by Ben or middle name intermittently), goes exclusively by Benjamin
4th: Alexander Nathaniel, goes by Alexander
It’s confusing, but that’s what’s worked in my family, and I think it’s worked pretty well. I anticipate that my brother will continue the initial tradition but not use any of the names.
I’m in the same boat as most readers – forgo using your husbands name as a junior for your child unless that is something you both really want and are on board with. I was about to suggest using Tyler James as a double middle name and see someone beat me to it!! All our kids have two middle names and we’ve never had any issues with it at all. You could even do Tyler James for all the boys and then do your first and middle for all the girls… Have fun with it so everyone’s happy.
Please please use Winston!! I so love this name and we almost named our son it.
Other names I love:
Winston
Walter
Louis
Oliver – perhaps too popular for you
George
Maxwell
Wells
Arlo
Oswald nn ozzy (love this)
I’m really not a fan of a junior and agree, in this case anyway, that it needs to go.
James Tyler and Jameson Tyler are both great alternatives while still honoring your Husband. I don’t see a problem with James Eaves at all and Jameson Eaves has a very distinguished sound to it!
The nickname Jay is VERY cute!
I’d also like to suggest Alexander Tyler James with the double middle names. Love the sound of Alexander Eaves!
Good luck!
What has occurred to me is that you want to name your sine after his father, but seem to think that having a Jr is the only way to do this. I think perhaps you just need to expand your horizons a bit
If you don’t like James, what about Jamie? You might also want to consider other language variants of James. Seamus comes to mind, which does feel very different than Winston, but still very British Isles so perhaps it could work. I’d suggest the website Behind the Name for more other language variants of James.
You don’t like Tyler, it’s not you style and you think it would be too confusing for everyday use. Perhaps Tyler could be reserved for the middle position? Still named after dad, but with a call name that works better for what you are looking for.
I will also suggest trying to match your husbands TJ initials. You could then use any T and J name you like. I’m sure there is at least one T name that fits with your name style
You say you would like a junior, so use Tyler James (I say this cringingly, because I personally dislike juniors). Call him Jay- it has the Gatsby feel, which goes well with Winston.
I agree with previous commenters…my first thought was Jameson. Jameson Tyler is nice and would flow nicely, even if it doesn’t fit perfectly, with sibling names
How about Tyson James? You still wouldn’t get a junior, and I’m ignorant of whether it sounds British enough or not, but it’s a very clear link to his father and less dated.
my son is the 4th generation Joseph W….. S..urname- in the family- his dad, great-uncle and great grandfather before him.
He was referred to as Little Joe when younger and his dad was Big Joe- now they are Joe and Poppa Joe respectively. We never had any real confusion within the family with their names – there were 3 of them alive at one point.
Many families use the same names over and over( because its important to them to honour their history ) and I don’t think it really causes that much confusion.
I also personally don’t see the point in giving your child a name that you are never going to use eg calling them by their second name .
As someone who recently battled my husband over a junior issue, I just thought I’d share that what we ended up doing was husband’s first name and a new middle name, which the child goes by. Why bother giving a child a first name you never intend to call him? Because your husband is difficult.