Dear Swistle,
We are expecting our first baby – a girl – at the beginning of April. We had a pretty hard time agreeing on a name, but after a lot of deliberation, we’ve decided to name her Mackenzie. Our last name sounds like F0rd. My question deals with middle names – specifically surname middle names. My husband and I would like to use my maiden name as the baby’s middle name. My last name sounds somewhat like F0lgers (but no coffee association), and when we got married I took his last name and moved my maiden name to the second middle name position. For various reasons, my maiden name is very meaningful to me.
The thing is Mackenzie is already derived from a surname. It’s not a surname in either of our families, but it originated as a surname. So her name would be a collection of all surnames. Is this weird or noticeable? I suspect that other people have run into this because of the popularity of surnames as first names like Parker, Fletcher, Anderson, Beckett, Kennedy, Jackson, etc.
I’ve also wondered if Mackenzie is unisex enough that it needs a feminine middle name to make it clear that it’s a girl’s name. However, since Mackenzie hasn’t been in the top 1000 names for boys since 2001, and it’s been in the top 100 for girls for the last 20 years, I think it’s safe to say that it’s gone completely to the girls like Kelly, Ashley, Leslie, etc.
If we don’t use my maiden name, we would likely go with either Marie or Jade. Marie would also be an honor name because it’s my middle name and my mom’s. But Marie doesn’t feel like a very specific honor name since it seems like half of the women I know have the middle name Marie. Jade is not an honor name – it’s just a name that we both strongly like but felt sounded silly as a first. (Jade F0rd sounds strange to me, but Mackenzie Jade F0rd sounds better to my ear for some reason.)
Technically we could give her 2 middle names, but I like giving her the option to push her last name to a second middle position like I did if she gets married and wants to, and my husband generally doesn’t like the 2 middle name option either.
What do you think about maiden names as middle names for babies with a surname-y first name?
Thanks!
If it’s your maiden name I see in your email address, one issue that may sway things toward using it is that I think it’s a much prettier name than F0lgers. But I would like the idea even if the name WERE F0lgers: I like very much when both parents’ family surnames can be incorporated.
It sounds as if the idea of two middle names doesn’t appeal to either of you, but if you DID go with that, she would still be just as able to structure her name the way she wanted to later on. Whether she starts as Mackenzie F0lgers F0rd or Mackenzie Marie F0lgers F0rd, she’s just as able to decide to be Mackenzie F0lgers F0rd MarriedName later on if she wants to. More names gives her MORE options, not fewer. But it does seem as if a Mackenzie F0lgers F0rd is more likely to keep the F0lgers part than a Mackenzie Marie F0lgers F0rd: the latter has more names to consider dropping (if any names will be dropped), so each name has a somewhat smaller chance of being kept.
One thing I liked about giving the kids two middle names is that it meant I still got to have the fun of choosing a middle name. It also reduced the surname-heavy aspect of it. But that was because I wanted ALL the kids to have my family name as a middle: if I were using it only for the firstborn, I would have felt differently about it.
Even knowing that Mackenzie is a surname name, it doesn’t feel much like a surname name to me anymore. If you were considering Miller F0lgers F0rd or Campbell F0lgers F0rd, I would feel like that was a lot of surname. I might very well still think it was a good idea to use it, but I’d see what you meant. But with Mackenzie, after 20 years in the Top 100, I think by now it feels more first-name than surname—more in the category of Mason and Jackson and Dylan and Madison than in the category of Anderson and Fletcher and Miller and Campbell.
I agree with you that the name is currently so used for girls, I wouldn’t feel the urge to use a clarifying middle name. In 2013, the name was given to 3,990 new baby girls and only 42 boys. And that’s only for that one spelling: the next most popular spelling, Mckenzie, was given to 2,196 new baby girls and 22 boys. The next most popular spelling, Makenzie, was given to 1,929 girls, but isn’t in the data base for boys.
I personally like Mackenzie Jade F0rd better. I grew up with a fairly common first name & last name and an uncommon middle name, so I think I associate middle names with a chance to be unique and special. I like my mother’s maiden name very much and I feel very attached to it, but I wouldn’t trade my middle name for it…it feels like I already have my mother’s maiden name as my mother’s maiden name.
All that being said though, I don’t think Mackenzie F0lgers F0rd is a problem in any way. Mackenzie to me is past even Madison & Jackson in the evolution of unisex surname name into just regular name mostly associated with one gender and getting close to being in the same category as Ashley or Shannon.
I actually really like Mackenzie F0lgers F0rd. Mackenzie is all girl to me. (I’m 20, and I’ve known one boy MacKenzie in my life (who went by Mack), and far more girl Mackenzies.)
I completely agree with Swistle that Mackenzie has passed the point of needing a feminine middle name to situate it gender-wise. It’s a female name right now. So don’t worry about that!
My main consideration with Mackenzie is just that it’s a little past its peak in terms of popularity, and possibly a few years away from being more of a “mom name” like Lindsay, Ashley, Jennifer, etc. are now. I have two teen/college age girl cousins with name Mackenzie, and I can see on the SSA baby names site that it peaked at #40 back in 2001. It’s been on a general fall ever since (though it did rise slightly last year.) It’s sort of from the pack of 1990s/early 2000s unisex names like Taylor, Alexis, Hayley, Sydney, Ashley, Morgan, that have been replaced by Harper, Avery, Aubrey, Riley, Skylar, Paisley… Then again Mackenzie never reached the heights of Taylor or Hayley or Alexis. It’s more in the Morgan/Sydney camp. And as Swistle points out, it is still given to a lot of girls! 3,990 in 2013. But– in 2001, it was given to 6,934. So it’s fallen by more than half in absolute terms in the past decade.
Anyway, just a consideration/perspective! It’s a very cute name and I do think it will be continued to be used for awhile.
But, I can’t help but consider– if your maiden name is as pretty as Swistle says it is, what about that as a first name for your daughter, with one of the feminine middle names you suggested? Just a thought!
I like that idea, using the maiden name as the first name. (I mean I think I like it– not 100% sure since I don’t know what it is and can’t guess.)
I would say it’s prettier than F0lgers as a middle name, but not first-name material.
Ah, ok. Thanks for the clarification, Swistle. :)
A perspective from someone whose parents made a similar choice:
I was given my mother’s maiden name for my middle name. However, I always wished I had been given two middle names like all of my cousins, one unique to me, one that I didn’t share with my siblings. When I got married, I dropped my original middle name and moved my maiden name to the middle slot, because I wanted to keep my maiden last initial as part of my initials.
I realize now that I could have kept both names as middle names and used my maiden last initial as my main middle initial for forms.
Also, consider that the world is changing and fewer women are changing their names upon marriage, plus not everyone gets married.
On the other hand, my parents are great people and did an excellent job parenting, not perfect of course, but excellent. So choosing your first parenting decision as they did could be a sign of good parenting decisions to come.
Whenever my husband and I are choosing names someday this will be our predicament. We very much so want to use my maiden name (now middle name) in our kid’s middle name spot. It makes me a little sad that we then won’t be choosing a regular middle name, but not enough that I would give the kid four names. Total preference though, my mother has two middles and loves her name. Giving family surnames as middle names is the way my husband’s parents named their four kids and all of them like it. I think you would regret not using the name since it is so special to you.
With McKenzie Jade, note the possibility of an MJ nickname. That might be a concern for some parents. I like the middle name as mom’s maiden possibility if it flows well–and I think F0lgers F0rd does (not sure if the real names are as good, but from Swistle’s response they might be even better!)
It took me a really long time to figure out what you were referring to, but it does make me ask the question (as I am completely out of touch) are the kids even calling it MaryJane any more?
Based on my experience, the kids are definitely not calling it Mary Jane anymore, unless they’re being funny (in the realm of using words like “groovy” or “far out”).
Any chance you might like to hyphenate the baby’s last name (Mackenzie Jade F0lgers-F0rd). I am a hypenated last name person, and while I didn’t always love it, I liked well enough, and because it is noticeable and unique (I am literally the only person in the world with my last name) I get remembered, which in my field is very helpful.
I personally like the two middle name option, but if you don’t I don’t see anything wrong with Mackenzie paired with a surname middle in lieu of a more feminine option. I know a one year old Mackenzie who has a surname middle name (that I don’t think is a family name) so her name is Mackenzie Morley Lastname. Also, while it may not be at peak popularity I know an 8 or slightly older Mackenzie, a one year old, and a newborn – so it is still in use and it doesn’t feel to me like it will be reaching “mom” name territory anytime soon.
This is probably a regional thing, but to the best of my knowledge I don’t know anyone who has dropped her original middle name, replaced it with her maiden name, and then taken her spouse’s surname as her surname. I know women who have kept their maiden names, women who have switched to their spouses’ surnames, and women who have hyphenated the two surnames, and that’s it. When I got married I considered all of those possibilities but it never occurred to me to drop my middle name. My point: don’t base anything about your naming decision on how she’s likely to change her name if she gets married. There are lots of possible options and you just can’t know what she’ll want to do.
As to Mackenzie itself, I don’t really consider it a surname name either – I think of it belonging to the “Mc names on girls” group (Mackenzie, McKenna, arguably sometimes Makayla). Mackenzie F0lgers F0rd doesn’t sound like a collection of surnames to me, and since your maiden name means a lot to you I vote that you use it. Also I like the rhythm of it better than Mackenzie Jade F0rd’s when I say it out loud.
I dropped my middle name (Anne) when I got married and adopted my maiden name as my middle name.
Me too. I’m in the northeast.
I did that when I finally changed my name after becoming pregnant. So did a few of my friends. I never liked my middle, though, and I love my maiden name.
I did too. I’m in Texas. Both my mother and her mother informally did the same thing (they used their maiden name as their middle initial, but I don’t know if they officially changed their names)
My middle name given at birth is a surname (Walker, my grandmother’s maiden name and my dad’s middle name), and I thought it was too much name to keep all four names, especially since my husband’s (now my) surname is another occupational surname ending in -ker (think Becker) and it got really rhymey and singsongy. But now I care less about that and wish I’d kept my middle name as one of my middles and added my maiden same as a second middle, because it tied me to my dad and grandmother, who are both now deceased.
I am in the northeast as well.
Both of my grandmothers dropped their original middle names in favor of their maiden names (born in Western PA and WV) All three of my aunts did the same (married in the early 70s- early 80s in Ohio) My MIL also did this, and so did the one aunt of my husband’s who I can confirm (both from MN) My mom did not bc it would have created an unusable monogram, something she occasionally still mentions when talking about new baby names.
I dropped my original middle name bc it was once of the boring middle names given out to babies in the late 70s.
This is interesting, it might be a regional difference or maybe just a social circle difference. I dropped my middle for my maiden name and no one batted an eye. I would say it is the most popular option among people I know besides just straight dropping father’s surname for husband’s surname. Most of the southern/southwest women in my family and friends have done it this way.
It is very common in the south, etc. North Carolina for women to drop their original middle names and put their maiden name in that slot upon taking their spouse’s last name at marriage.
I didn’t drop my middle name, but I did add my maiden name on as a second middle name. Even though that was the change I made legally, I still go by my maiden name and married name (without hyphen) professionally and socially.
Since you mentioned that it might be regional, I should have added: I live in the Southeast, but am from the West Coast.
I have 3 surname names — same situation as you’re where my middle is my mom’s maiden name. It’s never bothered me that my middle name was a surname — only that my last name is a common first name and my first name is rare. So people were always calling me by my last name. Doesn’t seem like that would be a problem with the first name of Mackenzie, though. I think you should go for it!
I took a poll on FB about this a year or so ago! I never heard of losing one’s middle name and moving the maiden name before so I asked about it and my mom, who was married in 1963 in NJ, said that in her high school business class they said it was recommended to do that so that banking didn’t get messed up? Or something? I guess that way you still had a record of what your name was before and after. I didn’t change my name when I got married and I always thought I’d use my last name as my kids’ middle name but when I had actual and not theoretical children, I found I didn’t want to. My last name is like Keyhole without the y or l, so for me it didn’t really lend itself to a name the way a Smith or Harris might. Anyway. I agree with Swistle (as usj) in that more middle names seems like MORE possibilities, not less, but if you guys are dead set against four names, I would go with Mackenzie (which seems like a lovely, feminine name) F0lgers Lastname. Good luck!