A. writes:
We are closing in our due date (Thanksgiving!) with our 3rd (and likely last) child, a boy, and are having a very hard time naming him. Our last name sounds like “Fort” but starts with an “Sh”. We already have two children, named Henry Ervin and Isabel Louise. Their middle names honor deceased relatives (because I am Jewish, we won’t honor living relatives through naming).
We generally prefer traditional names, but something like William or John/Jack feels too common. We have considered and rejected Charles/Charlie (I love it, but my husband does not), David (awkward familial association), and Daniel (for some reason, it doesn’t sound “strong” enough to either of us). For a brief time, we considered Jason but have fallen away from it as perhaps too much of our own generation and also perhaps not quite strong enough (in the same vein as Daniel). We would like to use either Daniel or Edward as a middle name, though, as they happen to follow our tradition of honoring deceased relatives with the middle name.
We seem to have happened into a short list of three favorites, none of which affirmatively feels just right at the moment. They are Malcolm, Brendan, and Patrick. Can you help with these (or make other suggestions)? Thank you very much!
I wonder if you’d like Nathaniel? Or perhaps it would have the same issues as Daniel. Henry, Isabel, and Nathaniel.
Because Paul and I had Henry, Charlie, Daniel, and Malcolm on our own name list, I’ll suggest a few more where perhaps our styles overlap:
Calvin
Edmund
Elliot (ends with T like surname)
Everett (ends with T like surname)
Felix (-x may blend uncomfortably with Sh-)
Frederick
Nicholas (-s may blend uncomfortably with Sh-)
Oliver
Simon (starts with S like surname)
Of these, my favorite is Oliver. Henry, Isabel, and Oliver. I also like Calvin and Everett and Elliot and Edmund. Simon would probably be my top choice except that I’m not personally as fond of alliteration; if you do like it, then Henry, Isabel, and Simon is at or near the top of my list.
I lean toward the ones without natural one-syllable nicknames: Ed __ort, Nick __ort, Fred __ort all sound a little abrupt to me. Calvin is an exception, I think because the softer L-ending is less choppy, and also because I know a Calvin who goes just by Calvin. But I think any of them are fine: it’s only a leaning, and so many kids don’t use nicknames now anyway.
I have a strong favorite among your three finalists (Malcolm, Brendan, Patrick): Malcolm. I like Malcolm Edward. Let’s have a poll to see what everyone else likes best:
[yop_poll id=”35″]
Name update! A. writes:
Thank you for posting our naming question for our third child and second son, brother to Henry and Isabel. You and your readers offered much helpful insight. Your favorite and the winning poll choice was Malcolm, which I love but about which my husband had some reservations. My husband discovered the name Callum, which has the same Latin root as Malcolm (meaning = dove) and is occasionally used as a nickname therefor in Scotland. Callum also shares properties with a name you suggested, Calvin (possible nn Cal), that we hadn’t considered before. We fell for this name in a way we hadn’t about any other name we’d considered. Callum Daniel was born 11/21/13, and we are all doing well. Thank you so much! Happy Holidays!
I voted for Brendan. I like all the names on your list, but Patrick & Malcolm are a bit harsher sounding to me than either Henry or Isabel. Perhaps it is the shared K sound?
I know a family with a Henry and Charles (Charlie). The 3rd brother is Samuel, so maybe you’d like Samuel?
I also love Swistle’s suggestions of Nathaniel, Oliver and Edmund. I’ll also throw out Thomas, James, Benjamin, Noah, Graham, Myles, Sebastian, Alistair & Theodore.
Great suggestions!
I like Levi and Colin and Paul and Peter.
Patrick Daniel seems the best of the three to coordinate with Henry and Isabel. Love the three names together — Henry, Isabel and Patrick.
Patrick and Brendan seem to be of a very different style than Henry. Maybe that is because they both strike me as very Irish while Henry seems very British. Also, Henry seems like a timeless classic to me while Brendan seems very 80’s. And brothers Henry and Patrick make me think of the early American patriot, Patrick Henry – though that isn’t necessarily a bad thing and probably won’t matter much to them.
I also like that Henry is not readily shortened (unless you use Hank as a nickname) and think name that either can’t be shorted or would be shortened to two syllables might work best.
With Henry and Isabel, I like Theodore (Theo), Andrew (Andy), Simon, and Elliot.
Malcolm was on our short list for our son Theodore. I think it’s a very strong, masculine name, and “Mal” is a great nickname.
I love Swistle’s suggestion of Nathaniel! I’m going to suggest/second:
Thomas Edward
Jack Edward
Peter Edward
I think these three names fit nicely with you sibset.
I agree that the style of the names Anonymous suggested probably fit better with the delightfully English sounding Henry and Isabel, than Scottish Malcolm or Irish Brendan or Irish-leaning Patrick.
I looked at the last two years of London Telegraph birth announcements to see what names some English families were using for brothers of Henry and found that the most popular combination was
Henry and George (or George and Henry).
Next most frequent brother names with Henry:
Charles/Charlie
Thomas
Oliver
William
Next:
Edward
Oscar
Frederick/Freddy
Other brother names with Henry that sound very British (but only came up once):
James
Jack
Hugo
Sebastian
Rupert
And I came across one sibling group with both a Henry and an Isobel:
…a daughter, Isobel, a sister for Charlie, William and Henry
Also britishbabynames.com gives these sibling name suggestions for Charles, including Isabel as a sister name and for brothers: James Andrew -Henry- George Thomas William
Another group of brother names with Henry among them:
Oscar Edward Henry James Louis George
Brother names for Arthur include Henry: Louis Stanley Wilfred Charles Edward Henry
And suggested brother names with Henry: Edward Robert William Oliver Rufus Charles
When I read the names Henry and Isabel together, I thought, “Tudor England”. This post from britishbabynames.com confirms that association with its long list of compatible male names for your consideration:
http://www.britishbabynames.com/blog/2013/05/terrifically-tudor.html
Great research and suggestions!
I think that Simon, Peter or Oliver are all great with Henry and Isabel.
Isaac, Joseph, Miles, Oscar and Julian would be my other suggestions.
Good Luck!
Wow so many great suggestions already!
My first thoughts were Oliver, Elliot, Sebastian, Theodore, William and James. And of these Oliver is definitely my pick.
I feel like a soft boys name fits well with your sibset but realise that you don’t like soft sounding names so perhaps my first thoughts are too soft.
Perhaps Oscar or Owen or Otis are stronger “o” names.
Perhaps Emmett or Everett are stronger that Elliot.
Samuel, Samson, Stephen stronger than Sebastian.
William seems to fit so well it is a pitty you don’t like it so much what about Liam instead? Really like Liam fits well!
I agree that your names sound british and that Brendan and Patrick are definitely Irish but they would still work. I voted for Patrick but I think other names that have been suggested would work better.
Some of the following names have all been suggested and some are new
Leo
Alexander
Arthur
Archie
Bennett
George
Joseph
Jonah
Noah
Alistair
Matthew
Michael
Louis – loo -ee
Jude
Benjamin
Maxwell
Rohan
Darcy
Good luck
I couldn’t decide between the three choices….
What do you think about Leo?? I think it goes really well with Henry and Isabel.
Another way to look at Henry and Isabel together is as Victorian favorites. After further thought it occurred to me that from a late-Victorian perspective, Malcolm -does- fit with them.
Britishbabynames.com confirms this:
1) Although Malcolm is of Scots Gaelic origin and a royal and clan name in Scotland, long popular there, it was later taken up by the English as well. Elea of BBN reports in her profile of the name Malcolm: “The UK census lists 3,284 males named Malcolm in 1841 (96% in Scotland, 4% in England) and 4,383 in 1861 (92% Scotland, 8% England). As Victorian Englishmen became fascinated with Scottish culture, so they began to adopt the names. In 1881 there were 6,649 (83% Scotland, 17% England) and 8,686 (73% Scotland, 26% England, 1% Wales) in 1901, showing that Malcolm was becoming more popular both sides of the border.” http://www.britishbabynames.com/blog/2013/08/malcolm.html
2) “Victorian Darlings”, a long list of “some of the popular and trend-setting names of the Victorian era”, includes both Isabel and Malcolm. As a timeless classic name, Henry isn’t on that list, but it was a favorite during the Victorian period too, ranking 8 in 1880. http://www.britishbabynames.com/blog/2011/05/victorian-darlings.html
3) All three names were among the Top 200 Most Popular Names in England and Wales in 1890: Henry (#10), Isabel (52) and Malcolm (180).
A very brief summation of the links between these three names: Henry, Isabel and Malcolm were all royal names, dating back to the early Middle ages in English and Scottish history. (One time the names intersected was in 1100 when Henry I of England married a daughter of Malcolm III of Scotland; one of Henry’s daughters was named Isabel.) Henry and Isabel were favorite names of the Tudors, but Malcolm was mostly a Scots name at that time. But in the 19th century the use of Malcolm in England began to increase so that by 1890 (or before) all three names were among the favorites of the late-Victorians. Thus if we’re viewing Henry and Isabel as an English-sounding subset, then Malcolm -does- fit — and very well: all three were Victorian favorites.
Henry, Isabel and Malcolm would be a more unique subset than pairing Henry and Isabel with many of the classic names I previously suggested (James, Thomas, etc.), although I like many of those pairings too. But among your three contenders, I now think that Malcolm is the best choice for your sibset. Henry, Isabel, Malcolm — three little “Victorian Darlings”.
(Just noticed that spell-check automatically changes sibset to subset most of the time.)
I also noticed that too! Annoying!
I also noticed that too! Annoying!
Again such in depth research, good work!
I find researching names very interesting and fun! I often gain a new appreciation for a name I’ve previously overlooked.
Thank you all for the wonderful suggestions and research, and thank you Swistle for posting my question!
It’s interesting, because the day this post appeared, my husband and I had started thinking of Callum as a name. Swistle’s suggestion of Calvin (plus her note that the one-syllable nickname of that name still seems to go well with our last name – I actually really like “Cal”) seems apropos, and Callum and Malcolm have the same meaning (Callum can actually be a nickname or “pet name” for Malcolm). Although Malcolm is running away with the poll, my husband doesn’t actually LOVE it (and neither of us likes the nickname “Mal” b/c of its Latin word-root meaning). This feels close to Malcolm without some of the reservations we have about that name. Thoughts!?
Thanks again for all the input!! This is great.
Malcolm has never been one of my favorite names, but objectively I think it’s a fine name, with the possible nickname “Mac”. And I think Malcolm goes well with Henry and Isabel — love your children’s names together and the Victorian connection of Henry, Isabel and Malcolm. Choosing between Malcolm (especially with the nickname “Mal” or “Malc”) and Callum, I would have to vote for Callum. But I’m wondering if you’ve considered giving your new son the formal name Malcolm and using Callum as his nickname. From what I’ve read, Malcolm and Callum come from the same source.
Oxford Dictionary of First Names (UK): “MALCOLM – Anglicized form of the medieval Gaelic name ‘Mael Coluim’, “disciple of St Columba”… see also Callum and Colm.” “CALLUM – Variant spelling of Calum, the Scottish Gaelic form of the Late Latin personal name ‘Columba’, “dove”. … Variants: CALUM (the usual Scottish form): Colm (usual Irish form).”
Scottish Forenames (published in Edinburgh): “MALCOLM – Gaelic ‘Maol Caluim’, “servant of [St] Columba.” It appears in old records as Malcolumb and Malcolium. …Callum is a variant.” “CALLUM – diminutive form of MALCOLM, with variants Calum and Cailean.”
Do you use nicknames for your children — maybe Hank and Izzy — or are they called by their given names? If the former, then a little Malcolm nn Calum would be a good fit, but if not, then I think Callum would fit fine with Henry and Isabel.
Callum too is very British, as is documented in this profile of the name on BBN, where it is not linked to Malcolm: http://www.britishbabynames.com/blog/2013/07/callum.html in 2012 Callum ranked 51 for baby boys born in England/Wales, and Calum ranked 78, but in the U.S. the Callum ranked way down at 810 while Calum didn’t even place in the SSA’s Top 100 names for 2012.
I like Callum a lot and have suggested it to at least one family member (we’re running out of classic boys’ names), but no little Callum in our large family yet (but we do have a Henry, of course). Although for me Callum feels like a good choice for parents looking for a Gaelic name, I think the name’s huge popularity in England, while being fairly unknown in the U.S., makes it a compatible choice as a sibling name with Henry and Isabel, both being names with a strong connection to England.
It sounds like you may have found your baby’s name. Good choice!
I checked Callum and Malcolm in several other name books: most link the two names:
Baby Name Wizard: “Callum can also be used as a nickname for Malcolm.”
New American Dictionary of First Names: “Calum… used in Scotland as a pet form of Malcolm.”
Wordsworth Dictionary of First Names (UK): “Callum, Calum see Malcolm” “Malcolm…other forms: Calum – Scottish Gaelic, with variant Callum (both used as names in their own right).”
But in other name books the etymology of the name Callum is similar to what is in BBN’s profile of the name.
Behindthename.com has a Related Name Tree for Callum, a sort of family tree for names that are in “the family of Columba”. (I’m not sure if this clears up the connection between Malcolm and Calum… or just makes it all more confusing!)
http://www.behindthename.com/name/callum/tree
I absolutely LOVE the name Callum and the nn Cal is great! I actually know a Callum who goes by Cal.
I do like Calvin though and Caleb nn Cal or Cale would also be a great choice. Stylistically Caleb may even “go” better with your sibset.
Henry, Isabel and Caleb
I really don’t think you can go wrong with any of the Cal names, they’re all great!
All the best!
I really like Callum and love Caleb but prefer the names in full to Cal. I know a couple of little Callums both go by Callum in full. Both seem to work well with your sibset.
I prefer Callum to Caleb and I adore the nickname Cal. I think a sibset of Henry, Isabel, and Callum works better than Henry, Isabel, and Caleb. I do not recommend using Callum as a nickname for Malcolm; I know it has a history, but I just don’t get it. It reminds me of how Dick is considered a nickname for Richard and how weird that seems (I’m sure there is a reason, but it still seems odd).
My personal favourites with your sibling set would be:
Leo. Henry, Isabel and Leo.
Charles. Henry, Isabel and Charles.
George. Henry, Isabel and George.
Tobias. Henry, Isabel and Tobias.
I definitely like Callum and think I prefer it to Malcolm. What about Campbell?
Good luck!
Ahh… I forgot to add my favourite…
Arthur! Henry, Isabel and Arthur.
Arthur, Artie… sooo cute! Definitely my favourite with the other two kiddos!
Love the Arthur suggestion
As soon as I read your Top 3, Malcolm immediately stood out to me as my clear favorite too! From Swistle’s suggestions, Calvin is my favorite. No surprise there, as Malcolm & Calvin have the same vibe. I love them both. I swoon a little bit saying them! : )
Callum Daniel is absolutely gorgeous!
Congratulations – Henry, Isabel and Callum make a beautiful sibset.
After your last post, I rather thought you’d go with Callum. Excellent choice for your family! Congratulations.