Avery writes:
Hi Swistle!
I’ve been a blog follower for over a year now, and I thought after reading all of your great suggestions to others, that when it came time for my husband and I to start talking about what we would name our baby, we’d magically agree and the name would just “work.” No such luck.Our baby girl is due in early fall and our last name sounds like Jasper with a “K.”
My husband is from a family with very traditional Catholic names. His name is Paul Joseph and all of his siblings have what I would consider to be older-style names. My husband goes by his initials, and we have both agreed that what we name our child is what we want her to be called–I strongly dislike nicknames. I’m a bit younger than my husband and my name is Avery. My name was considered “unique” when I was growing up and I always got compliments on how much people liked it. Of course now the name Avery is very popular, which is fine with me. I commend my parents on their great taste in naming.Our naming problem, I feel, stems from our own names. My husband, with his traditional, older-style name, can’t get on board with my more modern name choices.
The two names my husband is stuck on are Charlotte and Penelope. Both names that I would never, ever choose. I enjoy names that my husband considers to be “boy” names.
Names that I love:
Landry
Berkley
Rowan
Harper (This is at the bottom of my list of likes because I don’t know if I like the double “-er” sound, and because it seems to be quite popular.)Names that we removed from the list:
Caroline (We dislike the nickname Carrie. Again, I want our child to be called by her name, not a nickname.)
Brynn (It sounds too much like his Mom’s name.)
Brynlee (We think this would be cute for an infant, but a hard name to pull off as a 30-something professional.)
MaryAnn (I love this name because it pays homage to my grandmother; however, he has about 10 Marys on his side of the family, and that’s just too much name recycling for me.)We also do not care for the “Mc” first names or names that you have to look at for a while before you can figure out how to pronounce it. We want the name to be spelled exactly how it sounds.
Since my husband’s middle name happens to be the male form of Josephine, and he mentioned that he kind of liked that name for a girl. I agree it’s a good name–but it seems more fit for a middle name for me. As you can see, we have drastically different naming styles, and we can’t get anywhere on names. My husband said he could agree to pairing a traditional middle name with a more modern first name, but neither Charlotte or Penelope work for middle names.
Please help us so we don’t end up having a baby named “Baby.”
It’s unfortunate that you don’t like nicknames, because I think one of the best compromises in such situations is to use either a traditional name with a modern nickname (Caroline/Rory), or a modern name with a traditional nickname (Ellery/Ellie). If you have different naming styles AND you don’t want nicknames, two other methods come to mind:
1. One of you gets the first name and the other gets the middle name
2. Finding a third style, one that’s second-choice for both of you
One thing you have going for you is that you both like names that are currently in fashion. He’s not advocating for Ashley and Jessica, or for plain traditionals such as Elizabeth and Sarah: he likes recent/current favorites Charlotte and Penelope. You’re both fond of modern names, it’s just two different modern styles: vintage/revival for him, unisex/surname for you.
Your husband says he could picture using a modern name for the first name and a traditional name for the middle. This is a huge compromise move, and one I think it would be wise to grab while it’s still available. The corresponding compromise move from your side would be to give him more sway on both names: for example, give him his choice of middle name among all the ones you think would be fine (I don’t see any reason Charlotte or Penelope couldn’t work as middle names, depending on the first name), and work to find a group of modern names he finds appealing. Perhaps give him a copy of The Baby Name Wizard open to the Last Names First section or to the Androgynous section, and have him make a list of all the ones he likes.
If Brynn and Brynlee were names he was willing to consider, that gives us a jumping-off place:
Ainsley
Britt
Emlyn
Emryn
Finley
Hadley
Larkin
Linden
Linley
Linnea
Perrin
Quincy
Quinn
Tierney
Winifred
Winslow
Wren
Wynn
And if he considers your choices “boy names,” then I suggest digging through names of your preferred style looking for the more feminine choices. Ellery, for example, is modern and surnamey, but the Elle sound is very feminine. Or Delaney, which is used almost exclusively for girls, and which may sound decidedly girlish to him because of actresses Dana Delany and Kim Delaney. Or Waverly, maybe? Or Linley in the list above is similar to your choice of Landry, but the “Lynn” sound further feminizes it. Or Harlow, which is similar to your choice of Harper, but without the -er issue and with Jean Harlow.
Or you could have him turn to the Exotic Traditionals section and see if that’s the third style, the one you could agree on: unusual choices, but mostly feminine, and nothing so modern it’s never been used before. Bronwyn, perhaps, or Imogen or Cleo. Sometimes it helps to be able to refer to a name’s long and solid history—just in case anyone from the more traditional side of the family might be tempted to use an adjective like “made-up.”
i wish i could be more help but my pets are named charlotte and penelope. HA! you and your husband both have great taste in names. i’m sure you will find the perfect solution for your baby girl. good luck!
MaryAnn makes me think of the Mar-/Mer- names that are close to Rowan in style: Maren, Maret, Maris. They all have some link to Mary, but feel original, brisk, and tailored.
Maren Josephine
Maren Charlotte
Maris Josephine
There’s also Marley, but I suspect that’s too modern for your husband’s tastes.
Do you have any interest in continuing the Catholic saint route? I’m guessing no, but if I’m wrong, there are some really interesting obscurities out there. My favorite is Everild, also sometimes spelled Averil. I love both, though Averil is probably too close to Avery. Everild always feels modern to my ear, despite her Anglo-Saxon roots.
I LOVE this. Maren is such a fantastic name.
Mariel’s another great one.
Other names that might work are similarly cutting-edge-quirky with a nod to generations past. Things you wouldn’t have heard on many babies ten or twenty years ago, but that might even be old Hollywood in style.
Greta
Vivian
Clara
Beatrix
Cecile
Cordelia
Sabrina
Lillian
Evelyn
Stella
Anaïs
Vera
Catarina
Sylvie
Helena
Elise
I would reconsider Caroline, esp. if the only reason you took it off the list is that it has a nickname. Not every Caroline is called Carrie and you could gently correct anyone who tried to call her that. I think Caroline Penelope Jasper-with-a-K is a lovely name.
Would he go for Taylor with one of his favorites as the middle? Taylor Charlotte. Taylor Penelope. Even Taylor Josephine. They all work.
I agree. I teach 5th grade and have a Caroline in my class. She is never called anything else. Similarly, most of the girls in my class (and school) go by their full names as opposed to nicknames: Franceska, Daniella, Jessica, Andrea, Sofia, Bethania, Genevieve, etc.
Oh, and as for Mary-related names, there are so many– Mariah, Maura and Rosemary are favorites of mine.
I also agree that Caroline is a beautiful name, and one that people often struggle to find nicknames for – they are out there, but feel like more of a stretch and probably wouldn’t be as intuitive, so hopefully it would be easier for you to stick with Caroline in its entirety. Another compromise would be Charlotte with Charlie as a nickname (though this may be too nicknamey for you and too masculine for your husband, so you both lose instead of both win!).
I think Swistle’s suggestions are great – allow him some extra say in a first name of your taste, and give him some more leeway in the middle name of his taste, or consider a third category that blends the two.
I agree, I think I’d really look closely at the Marian group of names. You might both find something you’d like there.
You could also look at modern names that have a shorter history of being used on girls. They might not be as unique as you want and not as feminine/traditional as he likes, but they could strike him as just familiar enough that he’d be comfortable with them. Brynlee would’ve been a good one-as would your name, Avery. Some other ideas-Riley, Piper, Quin, Rory. I also really like the idea of Exotic Traditional names for you.
Hello there! We named our daughter Avery Catherine-it’s beautiful and suits her no matter who she is. I am an adult who changed her first name in her 20’s because I never felt like a ____. It didn’t suit me, and my goal in naming our kids was to choose versatile names that would work well for lots of different visions of who they might be. I also thought of Maren for you; I would not pick Caroline w/ your last name. I might consider Audrey, Willow, Annabel, Annaleise, Zoe, Isla/Aila, Sterling, Nora, Juliet, Bailey, Phoebe, Annika, Zela, Blair. Josephine or Penelope would make fabulous middle name choices for any of these! Best wishes!!
Ah, this is a great question.
First, I would encourage you to reconsider Caroline because I think it’s entirely possible to avoid a nickname. I know a few Carolines in different generations and none go by a nickname.
Because you like Josephine, I’m going to throw the name Georgia into the mix. No nickname, classic, and yet modern and “in” right now. I think Georgia Jasper-with-a-K sounds wonderful. Georgia Mary, Georgia Maryann?
Best of luck! :)
I know a Briarly, her parents had Brynlee and Bryn on their short list originally. Oh, and Briony! They seemed to have a thing for that combination of sounds. Briarly is not something I would have ever picked out myself, but it works so well on this little girl. She’s a doll. And they call her Briar on occasion, which is a potential nickname but one that seems more tailored, less cutesy.
So those are my suggestions if Brynlee doesn’t quite sit right:
Briarly
Briony (can be pronounced Bree-uh-nee or Br-eye-uh-nee)
I like Briarly Charlotte or Briony Josephine
I as totally going to suggest Briarly! It’s on our list and it’s a fabulous name. I also think Blair, Maris, Mara, Leighton, and Tinley are such great names. Your suggestion or Briony is also one of my favorites, no go for hubby though :( He keeps saying bri-ny and thinks of pickle brine. WHAT?!
Kate, too bad about Briony! Would he like it better pronounced Bree-ony? I’ve heard that in Britain. Briarly is such a cute name. I don’t think I would have given it much thought a few years ago but knowing a darling little Briarly has totally changed my opinion. It suits her so well!
Malia, maybe?
My mind went immediately to the name Marlowe Josephine. How stunning and regal! A modern first, traditional second (playing homage to dad).PLUS with the name Marlowe beginning with Mar- ,it could be a minute way to honour all the Marys in the family!
If Marlowe isn’t hitting the spot for you, you may also like:
Summer/Sommer
Annabel
Finlay
Dylan
Claiborne
Calloway
Honor
Charlie
Piper
Hollis
Quincy
Wren
Everly
Hazel
If you like Brynn but can’t use it, what about Blair or Blake? Both sound very feminine to me, even if they’re technically unisex. Blake might run together with your surname, but Blair Penelope Jasper-with-a-K is beautiful!
Lark or Lane might also fit your family nicely. I think the key here is finding unisex names that lean feminine, like Avery does. I like Rowan from your list very much for that reason.
What about Harlan (could modify the spelling to you taste… Harlyn, etc). Harlan, which is similar to Harper that you like but avoids the double -er with your last name. Also, Harlen is typically used as a boy name however, when I first heard it I automatically assumed it was a girl name, especially if you alter the spelling to something more feminine your husband would maybe go for it?
Other names I like:
Scarlett – older traditional name that has a hollywood flare that makes it more modern then names like Charlotte or Penelope –> Could be a good mix between your two styles.
Isadora or Isadore
Ellery – once again, apparently is most commonly used for a boy but when I see it/hear it, I automatically assume it’s a girl name.
Ellis – same as above
Ezra – same as above…. is it ever used for girls? I’d look into it, but to me the -ra ending I prefer on a girl
What are your other two children’s names?
In the United States, Ellery is used much more often for girls: in 2012, the Social Security Administration reports 17 boys and 201 girls named Ellery. Ellis is currently more unisex, but currently tipped toward boys: 399 boys and 216 girls. Ezra is used much more often for boys: 2064 boys and 120 girls.
I’m not seeing the part of the letter that mentions two other children.
Oops… I was reading the letter while bouncing my screaming newborn son on my lap… definitely thought it read that it was your third baby. Thanks Swistle for the update with the numbers of boy vs. girls in 2012 for each name.
I have thoroughly enjoyed reading all of these suggestions! I noticed Ellery was a common suggestion, but it’s just a little bit too close to my own name for us to be on board with it!
My husband and I actually think we have decided on a name by taking your advice, Swistle! We compromise with a modern first name and more traditional middle name. After she is born I will definitely send you our update! Bless your heart for helping us out!
Another way to help sort this would be for you to consider your daughter’s name as a continuation of a lineage that connects you, your mom, your grandmother, etc. For example, my own would be: Rose (grand), Claire (Mom), Gail, Bryn (my daughter). All these names are connectable by being short and clear. I mention this because Avery is indeed a unique name for someone of your generation, and because you’ve enjoyed having it I’m not sure you can simply stylistically overlook its uniqueness and be utterly comfortable with Caroline, or Josephine. Without knowing the names of your mother and grandmother I’m unsure what to suggest–I’m only suggesting that linking your family names might provide you with another way of arriving at a name that will work for you. I might totally give your husband first choice with a more traditional middle name as a compromise, which it sounds as if he’s already suggested. Good luck!
Since you like MaryAnn and surname-inspired names and he likes traditionally feminine names, how about Marion? It has the same sound, is all girl, and what seems like a sassy but traditional spelling. Marion Jasper. Marion Josephine. The Mary and Joseph connection may be a bit much for some people, but people outside of family members rarely remember middle names. Also, your husband’s Roman Catholic family may LOVE it. Also Marion might be confused over the phone for MaryAnn, but this would only be a minor concern for me.
Francesca and Francis might also be a good compromise solution. I knew a Francesca growing up during the time of nickname default who always went by Francesca. It is a striking name that is all girl but derived from a masculine name. Francesca Josephine. Francesca Jasper. This name has a long history, but ranked at #491 is fairly unique in the US.
You may also like Neve, Brooke, Hazel, Lorna, or Paloma.
What an interesting dilemma!
I second one commenter’s suggestion of Willow (Willow Penelope, Willow Charlotte, Willow Josephine – all fantastic!) and offer some more suggestions that might bridge your tastes:
Quinn
Olivia
Everly (too close to Avery?)
Evelyn
Madeline/Madeleine/Madelyn/Maddison (if you don’t want her to get ‘Maddie’, I’m sure she won’t)
Stella
Piper (though it may clash with your last name like Harper does)
Juniper (I think this is fantastic)
Blythe (stunning name with a gorgeous meaning) – Blythe Penelope is absolutely wonderful!
Ivy (too close to Avery?)
My favourites for you at the moment would be Blythe Penelope, Willow Charlotte and Quinn Josephine. Best of luck to you two! Can’t wait for the update on this one.
I am going to plug Molly Ann as an alternative to your MaryAnn. It’s a name that transitions well from baby to girl to woman, and is its own nickname. I named my daughter that to continue a Mary tradition in my family. Maura Ann(e) was my back up ‘Mary’ name. I didn’t pick it only because Maura doesn’t go with my last name but I think it sounds lovely with yours. I really like the Maren suggestion too, as well as Georgia in the non-Mary category.
Some suggestions that come to mind:
Bernice
Bronwyn
Aubrey
Auburn
Sabrina
Tessa
Hazel
Maisie
Morgan
Casey
Good luck
What about Bronte? As in Charlotte?
If you would consider a nn… How about Josephine as a formal name but nn Posey or Penelope nn Poppy or Nell? I also think Caroline in full is totally usable and love the name!
Or maybe…
Molly
Sophie
Gemma/Jemma
Jane
Grace
Claire
Maggie or Maisie
Paige (Perhaps Paige Caroline…?)
Edie
Maeve
Margo
Oh, and not sure if anyone has suggested this already but how about Maris or Meryl?
I have a Caroline and so far we have gone 4.5 years with no one calling her Carrie – even though another 4 year old Caroline moved in next door. Both only go by Caroline, though my husband occasionally calls her Cara.
Other ideas (closer to his in style but maybe something you like):
Cora
Marigold
Anthea
Phoebe
Poppy
Swistle’s advice is great. Although I think Josephine Berkeley and Rowan Penelope would be great! Some more suggestions in that vein (first and middle could also be swapped):
Unisex names with a feminine classic in the middle:
Sidney Caroline
Blaire Carlotta
Nico Amelia
Darcie Madeleine
Arden Isabel
Marley Anneliese
Hollis Eleanor
Nickname-free girl names with a modern feel and more masculine middle name:
Everly Brynn
Zoe Dylan
Maya Landon
Paisley Sawyer
Isla Bennett
Lucy Addison
Mila Bryce
Violet Colin
Thank you so much for answering my question, Swistle! These are all great suggestions!
I noticed the name Ellery was suggested by several commenters. It’s a nice name, but seems a little too close to my own name for us to be on board with it.
To be honest, I had mentioned almost every single name on your list to my husband prior to receiving your suggestions, so you definitely grasp my taste in names!
I actually loved your advice of pairing a modern name with a more traditional middle name and my husband went with it! As soon as little miss is born I will update you with her name choice!
Thanks again to you and all the great readers who commented!
UPDATE!
Berkley Dawn was born on the 9th of October. We have had so many compliments on her name–lots of people enjoy that it is a name they haven’t heard before, but it’s not too off-the-wall. We could not be happier with our name choice, or our little princess!