We are in the last few days before the College Decision Deadline of May 1st. Edward has submitted an acceptance/deposit to his second-choice school, because he is waitlisted for his first-choice school, and waitlisted students don’t find out if they’re In until after the decision deadline. All of us feel content with this situation, except for the part where we can’t really tell anyone where he’s going yet, and we might lose a multi-hundred-dollar deposit. But his second-choice school and his first-choice school have been VERY CLOSE in his personal rankings, and in fact they swapped places a few times during the decision-making process, so what I mean is that we’re all content with the idea of him going there. And he knows that if he continues to yearn for his first-choice school, he can re-apply there next year and would very likely get in, assuming his grades at his second-choice school are good. (One of the main reasons he didn’t get into his first-choice school, we believe, is that he wants to major in computer science, and our high school’s computer science teacher left because of the pandemic, and so the high school did not have computer science classes or a computer team as they usually would; the first-choice school is very selective for computer science majors, and didn’t have much to go on when evaluating Edward’s application.)
Elizabeth is still unsure. She has run into that thing many of us run into with many of life’s decisions, which is that there is NO WAY TO KNOW what would be best/right (or even what she might PREFER) on SO MANY FACTORS OF THE DECISION. Right now her essential decision is between: (1) a stand-alone art school and (2) an art school within a university. The stand-alone is about two-thirds the price of the university, after scholarships and financial aid; it is not THE name-brand art school, but [editing this part of the sentence, because the guesses are indicating to me that I gave a misleading description; it is not the one in Georgia, because Georgia is not currently a safe place for a person with a uterus to have a medical emergency; but:] it was her clear favorite of all the stand-alone art schools we visited. (She got into THE name-brand art school, but we visited it and she disliked it.) (Not to mention the COST, which was BEYOND BOGGLING.) The stand-alone has hundreds and hundreds of students; the university has thousands and thousands. The stand-alone is further away (“plane ride” distance), and in a pleasing and interesting city; the university is nicely far away (“8-hour drive” distance), but in a depressing strip-malls-and-oversized-parking-lots suburb of a city (but with several interesting cities nearbyish). The university would give her the ability to do/create a combined major, or do a minor in a non-art field; the stand-alone would not. The university would provide fellow students who were not art majors; the stand-alone would not. Those are all the issues she has mentioned that are relevant to her.
At this point, after talking with her about it for hours and hours, my feeling is that she is going to have to get to the last minute and then just PICK ONE. Both schools are great choices in their own ways, and neither one of them has ALL the things she wants, and on some issues she doesn’t even KNOW what she wants—nor does she know HOW to know. She and I are both feeling some regret that we did not successfully find a university she felt more enthusiastically about than this one—but we DID LOOK QUITE A BIT, and she just never had a “WOW!!” reaction to a university, which she knows doesn’t mean a university isn’t the right decision.
A lot of college-choice stuff is framed as if it’s a romantic movie (find The One!! and you’ll Just Know!!), and it IS that way for some people, but it wasn’t that way for me and it hasn’t been that way for Elizabeth, and that’s normal too. It’s normal not to have all the information you need to make a decision, and yet get to the point where you have to make a decision anyway; it’s normal not to find one single college that has everything you wanted; it’s normal not to know what you like until you try; it’s normal to need to switch, once you have more information.
We’re at the visiting schools phase with my youngest– that’s how we spent spring break–so this topic is interesting to me.
When my oldest had to decide it was a three-way tie right up until the last week, which made me glad he only applied to four schools. I had a This is the One feeling about my college, but he didn’t. He’s been pleased with his choice anyway.
I picked my university in part in part because the cafeteria lady was really nice and patient when I visited. It seemed like a friendly place, and it was, and I loved being a student there. Maybe it is only a The One moment in hindsight, but I think that’s sometimes how memory works anyway.
I really enjoy your college themed posts. Thank you so much – and good luck to your kids in their decision making.
Some close friends + former colleagues of mine attended “a” name-brand art school in a funky and interesting coastal Southern city – and I’m making a wild assumption and guessing Elizabeth’s stand-alone choice is that one – and if so, I want to add my endorsement for the city (small, accessible, lots of young people, warm, history, very cool) and the school – the folks I know who graduated are gainfully employed and happy.
If it’s in Georgia, my cousin’s child goes there and reports are she likes it very much. I think she started in the Atlanta campus, switched to Savannah, and then back to Atlanta.
If it’s Chicago we took an entire trip to visit the Thorne Rooms and were not disappointed (listened to the 68 rooms books and the children were sufficiently enthralled that we went).
All this speculation is fun! Google says THE school is in RI.
It’s impressive that she has the skill, talent, and drive to get into any art school. It’s not easy. Go, Elizabeth!
Do we know her preferred medium? I can’t remember. My school had a great art department and I took drawing, printmaking, and glass. I do not have the inspiration or drive to be an artist full time but creating is SO MUCH FUN! Art classes rule. I want to learn to throw pots.
She is primarily drawing/painting and some 3D/mixed-media stuff, but her high school doesn’t have many other options (they have photography, which she didn’t have room for in her schedule, and pottery, which she’s trying now), so I’m super interested to see how she does in other classes!
She must be good. Everyone does drawing/painting, so she would have had to stand out and it’s harder to do so.
Art is so fun! If you don’t make me try to market and sell MY art. I could likely sell someone else’s.
Yes, and I wish we would normalize all that. Also that sometimes the inability to decide means college shouldn’t actually be the next step and you should spend a little time in the world before attending. (And I don’t mean traveling on Mom and Dad’s dime, but working and exploring.)
I also don’t mean I think this is the case for Elizabeth. It sounds like she’s ready and there is no “wrong” decision. I wonder if this is the time to flip a coin. So often, when you do you realize your hoping for a certain outcome and then you know what your decision actually is. As an overthinker, this sometimes helps me get out of my head and hear what my heart is saying.
Oh my, that flip-a-coin strategy is exactly what I use and is something I was going to suggest also. For me, the key is to flip the coin and then pretend the decision is binding, if I have to describe that, I’d say I have to pretend for 24 hours. But really, it’s more like, “Pretend until/unless I get a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach,” in which case I know the coin flip resulted in the wrong decision. I find this surprisingly effective as a decision-making tool.
Some fun research about choosing whether to make a life change or not, based on a coin toss:
Heads or Tails: The Impact of a Coin Toss on Major Life Decisions and Subsequent Happiness
https://academic.oup.com/restud/article-abstract/88/1/378/5834495
“Little is known about whether people make good choices when facing important decisions. This article reports on a large-scale randomized field experiment in which research subjects having difficulty making a decision flipped a coin to help determine their choice. For important decisions (e.g. quitting a job or ending a relationship), individuals who are told by the coin toss to make a change are more likely to make a change, more satisfied with their decisions, and happier six months later than those whose coin toss instructed maintaining the status quo. This finding suggests that people may be excessively cautious when facing life-changing choices.”
Wow, interesting!
The Phoebe pregnancy test decision method! Flip a coin (or have someone decide for you) and see how you feel.
Oh man, I do not envy Elizabeth’s decision! I remember trying to choose between grad schools and that being insanely difficult; it’s hard to imagine trying to make that decision without four years of college already under the belt.
I will say that in my undergrad experience the town/city mattered a lot less than I thought it would. At a university there are always plenty of activities and events and parties going on, and most of the people I knew didn’t venture outside of the greater campus area on a regular basis.
I regret the grad school I chose and I think if I had chosen differently, I might have finished that degree instead of dropping out. On the other hand, I’m very happy with my life, and if I hadn’t chosen the wrong school and dropped out I never would have moved back home and met my spouse. So in the big-picture whole-life sense I don’t regret it. :-)
So normal, so so normal! And I second the idea to flip a coin, it can be very illuminating: “It came down X, but I don’t want to do X … oh, wait. Well, now I know.”
Regarding art schools – my daughter is at a BIG school and has friends planning to major in art. At the end of this year – sophomore – the art majors have a huge project to see if they actually can get into the art school. If they don’t make it, they have to choose another major – something to check at the university if she chooses to go there.
Congratulations to both Edward and Elizabeth on having multiple good options to consider and (hopefully in Edward’s case — but as you say, if not this year then presumably next) choose from.
I’m currently listening to a book called, “Designing Your Life: How to Build a Well-lived, Joyful Life,” that I have picked up partly because it was recommended-ish for me as someone who works advising undergraduates on things related to, well, designing their lives. It uses the design thinking ideas and so far I’d say it ranges from not-bad to useful, though maybe with a cautionary note that much of the dialogue is focused on people with various kinds of privilege, i.e., able-bodied, able to afford an assortment of life choices, with passports and/or visas that give them access to developed-world options, and such. But that said, I don’t think the book’s advice is necessarily useful only to people with those characteristics (blessings? advantages?), only that that is its chief focus and a lot of its examples start from those assumptions. Anyway one of the points it makes repeatedly is that there is no “one best path” but rather often a range of good alternatives, any of which will lead to excellent outcomes, even if not to the same excellent outcomes as the other alternatives would. Which sounds a lot like (particularly) Elizabeth’s situation, though of course that doesn’t mean the decision still isn’t a difficult one to make.
My daughter got in to some schools that she didn’t get much financial aid from, and into others that offered her a huge amount of aid. Wouldn’t you know that she was unhappy with the combination— the places that gave scholarships weren’t her “dream schools.” We told her to go to one of the schools we could afford (very similar in location, style, size, and majors available) and reapply for aid the following year, so she could transfer.
In the meantime, she’s thrown herself into college life: choir, rock climbing club, outdoor adventures, lots of friends, found a job. She changed her major and is thriving.
Turns out she doesn’t want to transfer.
It’s anecdotal, but I’ve worked with college students for over 25 years and if they commit to the college, it’s really likely to be the right place.
My senior is also in this spot… well, she has pretty much chosen and is actually taking herself on a day trip to her likely choice today for one more look. She looked a everything from a tiny liberal arts college OOS to several large in state schools. The school I thought would be her top choice (one of our state’s flagship ginormous universities, the most prestigious of her 5 choices, the hardest to get into, closest to home, which is likely a negative, also happens to be my alma mater!) Her final choice looks like it’s going to be another mid-size state university where she will likely be very happy – biggest drawback to her is no football team, biggest perk is location (beach town!)
We went on one college tour to a giant out of state SEC school she thought would not really be a contender and they very nearly sold her on it during the campus tour. She decided against due to cost (twice as much!) and distance (3 times as far.) But one thing they said on the tour that stuck with us was that you can always make a big college smaller (by finding your people, your program, your place in it) but you can’t make a small college bigger.
Wow, very exciting and interesting times in the Swistle house! I have a question. How is Henry doing? Does it feel strange for him to be the only one at home? My older son is going to be at university next year and he and my younger son are VERY CLOSE and while the university is close to us, it’s still a Big Change. I can imagine with four older siblings it might also feel very strange to Henry?
We’re wondering, too, how he’s going to feel about that! He’s pretty social, so my guess is that what will happen is that his friends will start being over here a lot more! (Which I would enjoy.)
My son is a Junior in art school in Georgia that some are talking about (but not naming) at the Atlanta campus. We live about an hour away and he had his eye on that school for years and years so we never looked at other art schools. We all expected that he would want to attend the other campus in GA but when we visited, he decided he preferred Atlanta. Anyway, all this to say that if this is the school she’s considering and you have any questions, please feel free to reach out.
My youngest struggled to choose, and was so afraid of making the wrong choice. It turned out that she was not, in fact, happy there, so after three semesters she transferred to the local commuter campus of the big state university, she was very happy there and graduated with honors. It’s not a one time choice.
oooh, I do not envy Elizabeth’s position. I chose a school because it was the only one in my province to offer the program I wanted. I didn’t factor anything like school size or location in (this is probably not a good way to make decisions, but I was 18 and the first in my family to go to college, none of us knew what we were doing). I got accepted into the program and the school proceeded to cancel the program due to lack of interest. Luckily I had applied to, and was accepted by, other schools in other cities, but with different programs. I picked one somewhat randomly and it turned out absolutely fine. There was never a feeling at any of the schools that THIS is THE ONE. The school I ended up at was great, the program was ok and I met many wonderful people, including my husband.
From my long-ago art and art history studies in college, what turned out to be far more memorable and significant than I was aware of at the time was access to museums and galleries to see actual real world art. My peers and I were mostly at the same level and it was very inspiring to see other work easily. Something for Elizabeth to consider, maybe. Also echoing that there is likely no wrong choice here.
Good luck to E for making the decision! I also heartily agree that there are a lot of right choices.
Also, I was wondering how you are doing with all the decision making? Your wording is dispassionate here, but I can imagine getting swept up in the emotions of the moment!
Oh you are RIGHT. I have been going to bed early some nights, not even to sleep but just to lie in bed and play Candy Crush in the dark and try not to think about college decisions!
In my own college-decision days, I was very torn between two schools. I had been accepted at both, visited both, had friends at both; I just could not decide. And then one day I came home from school and my dad told me he had gotten a call from the admissions office at School A, and they had offered me a full scholarship. Instead of being elated, I felt sad–and instantly knew that School B was really where I wanted to be. I told my dad how I felt . . . and that’s when he told me he had called School B, told them of A’s offer, and they matched it.
#1, my dad is the best. And #2, sometimes you have to get what you *think* you want to realize what you *actually* want. I don’t know if this story could be helpful for you; maybe you could ask Elizabeth to visualize finding out one school is the ONLY option, and see how she feels about that?
Dittoing the coin flip suggestion.
How fun and stressful to have things slowly settling into place! Funny to think that in a few months all the uncertainty will become a decision and eventually feel normal.
When I was looking into colleges, my mom pressured me into going to her (and my dad’s) Alma Mater, which was a plane ride away. I responded to the pushing by refusing to apply and went away to a different school equally far away, where I was quite happy.
Fast forward a decade, and I began dating a great guy, whom I later married. It wasn’t until he showed up to our third date wearing the T-shirt that I realized that he’d gone to my parents’ school. He had loved it to death and owned tons of gear. Now I have lots of photos of my small children wearing cute little University onesies. Life is funny that way!
I also ended up getting my Masters at a runner-up for my original school choice.
I know when I was eighteen, it felt like there could be only one college winner and the rest of my choices were lost opportunities. But of course it wasn’t so clear cut as I imagined then.
I regretted my college choice and it turned out fine. I chose a college that was way too far away for a person with separation anxiety. I freaked out and dropped out a few weeks into my first semester. I couldn’t get transfer scholarships as a dropout, so I went to community college and then state schools. Despite all this, I went on to get a PhD and, more importantly, pay off my student loans.
I also didn’t have the fall in love with a college experience. I had grown up knowing that it was expected I would go to college and so I had no idea at all what any non-4yr-college options were. Add in massive burnout my senior year due to overachieving the first 3 years so I could get into college and I was just kinda meh on the whole choosing a college thing. I mean, how are you supposed to know???
I was intimidated by the idea of huge campuses with 10s of thousands of students (my grandfather went to Berkeley and was so excited to show me around the campus and I was horrified when we were still driving on city streets but were apparently on campus) that I ended up looking at small schools that had undergraduate enrollments that were smaller than my high school – like 2000ish students. I ended up blowing a quite generous scholarship to a lovely private school due to a variety of reasons (temperament and undiagnosed ADHD), but one thing I did discover from that year of living on campus (because lololol I never attended classes after the first week or two aside from one month long class (40+ year old me facepalms mightily at 18 year old me)) is that I needed enough students to be inconspicuous. When I stopped attending classes, my teachers NOTICED and then they CALLED my dorm room! I can see now how lovely and supportive that is, but then I was horrified that not only was I unable to attend classes, but that my absences were being noted and drawing attention which made it harder to go back to the classes even if I could.
So if Elizabeth is equally happy with both places, I’d have her think about how she feels about anonymity or the lack of it. A small student body is a lovely thing when all you are ever told during tours and such is how much more individual attention you get during classes, etc, but that also means that there’s no place to hide because your presence/absence is noted.
To close out the anecdote, I ended up going home after my first year (I refused to beg to stay after failing to get off academic probation my second semester) and took a full load of classes at the local junior college while I also worked full time. I ended up going back to a 4 year state university (with a significantly larger undergraduate population than the small private school) after a couple years and finally got a degree that is totally useless at the bachelors level.
My son (also a senior) chose the big campus closest to him that my husband went to and honestly I was pretty surprised. But he is happy about his decision & looking forward to August.
Next kid is currently a sophomore and right now his top choice is due to a football mentor having gone there and his fondness for a particular restaurant near campus (not kidding). Since it’s also an in-state school, I’m kind of shrugging my shoulders at this point because it will be FINE.
PS Swistle, you used my actual given name on your recent Laura/Lauren baby name post and I absolutely never see it anywhere! :)
I’m waiting eagerly for next week when we (hopefully will) hear the final decisions! Best wishes to all of you! I went through this for the first time (as a mom) last year and it is not easy!
I went through the normal angsty college application process as a teen, applying to and being accepted / rejected by various smallish well-regarded liberal-arts schools. But then because of a big family crisis I ended up having to take a gap year, and I couldn’t defer my admission to my prestigious top-choice because I had been accepted off a wait list. I figured I would apply again the following year to the same schools. But after a year of working, I had completely changed my mind, didn’t even want to go to that school, and ended up applying to literally one school – a giant private university in a big city that I was sure I could get in (not very prestigious at the time, but far more so now), and I had a really great college experience. My current feeling, as my daughter starts the process, is that pretty much anywhere can be great, as long as she bases her decision on what she *wants* to do, not what she *should* do. And you can always switch! Good luck to Elizabeth as she decides between what sounds like two great options
My daughter is interested in architecture/design degrees and we have visited two different campuses that could not be more different… and she is absolutely torn between the two if she gets in to both! And I could see her loving both too, it’s not that she’s indecisive – one has a really focused program with a great reputation and a fantastic co-op component, on a tiny, isolated campus with almost zero non-program-related amenities, the other would lead to a degree with a broader range of study but is on a huge, beautiful campus with guaranteed residence for first year and more options and student support than I’d previously been able to imagine (think bunny yoga and on-campus nutrition counselors).
I’ve told her that she can always try one and change if she feels she made a mistake. Or she might not get into both which would make the decision a LOT easier: one has a 7% acceptance rate and the other has a 5%. She’s never not achieved what she’s set her mind to, so it’s hard to picture her not getting into at least one of them, but I guess we’ll see. In the meantime, I guess we’ll visit a few more and make her choice even harder maybe?…
As the parent of a much younger child, this is very fun to imagine and also slightly terrifying. BUT would it help her/you to frame it as, “it’s great that I have two choices that both might be a good fit for me, and therefore I will choose one, and if I’m not happy there, I can switch and choose the other and that will be okay too”? Maybe takes some pressure off?
It’s interesting, I very much do not believe in The One for romantic relationships, but I had a One for college. At age 17, I was so flipped out by the idea of a big decision that it was easier to just choose something, anything, and apply early decision and then KNOW and be DONE. It wound up being great and I loved college. I think I would have also been happy at many other places, just like I would be happy with many other partners — but it speaks well for Elizabeth and for you that she feels confident enough to live in the uncertainty.