I would really enjoy hearing someone say “He’s not a very good housekeeper” or “She doesn’t help out much around the house,” instead of ALWAYS WITH THE PRONOUNS THE OPPOSITE WAY. We’ve mastered the “men don’t ‘babysit’ their children” concept; I vote for housework to be next. Paul rolls his eyes at my household-cleanliness fretting/self-consciousness, but I think that eye-rolling comes from being 100% secure in the knowledge that NO ONE IN THE WORLD will come in and say, “Whoa. Paul’s not much of a housekeeper, is he?” NOT EVEN WHEN I WAS WORKING FULL-TIME AND PAUL WAS THE AT-HOME PARENT.
Speaking of which, we are playing Chore Wars at our house. I read about it in a book called Reality is Broken, which says, basically, “Instead of complaining about how people play computer games when they could be engaging with reality, why don’t we see if we can use what we’ve learned from computer game concepts to improve engagement with reality?”
Farming is not a whole lot of fun, I’m guessing. But make it into a Facebook game and people will do it for HOURS, UNPAID, for FUN. I remember when I was playing Sims, and I’d suddenly realize that I was spending an hour cleaning my Sims house and interacting with my Sims children while my actual house/children went unattended. We will willingly do things in a game that we don’t want to do in real life.
Part of is the whole “getting credit” concept, which is why I like my FitBit, and why I want something that tracks Good Citizen Points. Part of it is that it really is more fun to play a farming/cleaning GAME than to do actual farming/cleaning. But that doesn’t mean we can’t take some of the fun parts of the game and apply it to the actual chores.
This is what my brother and I used to do with chores when we were younger. Our least-favorite chore was filling the giant woodbin with a week’s worth of wood from the piles outside. It was tedious and uncomfortable and time-consuming and not particularly satisfying. Until we started pretending that there was a blizzard coming and that the number of days our family could survive was dependent on how much wood we could get into the house before the storm hit. Or we’d make a challenge to see if we could fit the logs together as snugly as possible to get the maximum amount of wood into the bin, with the challenge being to see if there’d still be wood in the bin the NEXT week when we had to do the chore. I mean, we still had to do the chore. It was still uncomfortable and it still took awhile. But it was a LOT more fun that way.
Chore Wars is similar: you still have to do the chores, and you still don’t enjoy them per se, but they’re MORE fun than before, and also you get CREDIT. I recommend it, if you think your family might enjoy it. I’ll say this for it: the children are coming home from school and racing each other to do housework. Someone OTHER THAN ME cleaned a toilet this week.
Paul and the kids are a lot more into the storyline than I am; I find the whole “battling monsters and collecting treasure” part uninteresting and unmotivating. (What I like best is GETTING CREDIT and having everyone see how many more points I have than they do.) I’ll add a new adventure such as “cleaning the toilet,” and Paul will change it to “polishing the throne in the hall of fountains” or whatever. I find this irritating when I’m looking for the chore in the list—but Paul pointed out that it’s the children’s favorite part so…it stays. Our arrangement now is that I add the chores with boring titles and no monsters/treasures, and Paul goes in later and spices them up, so that now there’s a 25% chance of encountering Jabba the Butt (sigh).
You set your own points system for each chore, and you can change it whenever you want. I like this because it might only take 5 minutes to clean a toilet, and points are supposed to be approximately 1/minute—but I want 20 points if I do it, and I’m happy to give 20 points to someone else for doing it. Hazard pay. Or, like, we’ll realize the children are doing a chore so often that now it doesn’t take as long: it takes a long time to clean the floor and wall around the cat dishes if it hasn’t been done for weeks, but it’s the work of a moment if it was done the day before.
You can also add “quests,” which are chores that disappear from the list when someone claims them. So for example, I’ve lost my wedding ring (woe), and so I put it on the list as a quest: 100 points to whoever finds it. Or if I want Paul to fix something, I can put it as a quest and it works a lot better than nagging.
This sounds pretty genius, might have to try it when my kids are a bit older!
This sounds awesome. We are always looking for ways to get our oldest to be more responsible. He’s five and he keeps his room (his original responsibility) very tidy already because he’s afraid of things left on his floor at night so we need something to get him involved more in the overall house keeping. He hates feeding the cat (which, what? it takes two seconds) so this might be the trick. We don’t let him on the computer hardly at all so this might feel like a treat to him.
Oh my gosh, that is the kind of thing I find highly motivating, and I’m sad that my kids are too little to understand it! I’m hoping that perhaps I could find some other grown ups who would want to be on a team with me and we’d each just do the work on our own homes ;)
Yes! I’m thinking my infant would not be a great teammate. And I need some like Paul for the amusing descriptions because I lack the time and energy, but would find them amusing.
You are a genius mother.
Brilliant. I especially like the quest idea.
Yep. I’m signing up. And when you launch the “he’s not a very good housekeeper” equality campaign I’m first on board. Pet peeve!
That really is a great idea!! Could this work with a (almost) 5 and 7 year old? I know they can pick up their toys and the older one can sort of make her bed. The can both put clothes in the hamper and bring their dishes to the sink (but I haven’t trained them to put them in the dishwasher). They have washed my kitchen floor with a spray bottle and rag, but they don’t do a good job.
Speaking to the first part of your post, as a stay at home mom, I get confused sometimes about my role. More than one of my friends feel it is “part of the job description” to do most of the housework. But being a stay at home mom isn’t just housework. We have to actually interact with the kids (my younger one is only in school 9 hours/week) and there are other duties which take up a lot of time, like driving kids to sports/activities, grocery shopping, cooking dinner, making breakfast and lunch also and clean up after those things. And then if you have younger kids, there is the time it takes to get them down for naps, maybe multiple times per day….so….I am wondering, should it be my job only? This isn’t 1950, yet I am in a 1950’s role.
It seems to me that all members of a household should share chores, if for no other reason than that it’s not good for anyone’s character to do no chores, or for anyone’s relationship to have one human being doing all the dirty work for another human being—even if one person were at home with no children/occupation at all. I consider these two separate issues for a couple to decide upon together: one issue is “How shall we earn money and spend our available work hours?” and the other is “How shall we share the chores?”
The youngest child in my household is 6, and we’re finding lots of things for him to do. Definitely he doesn’t do as good a job as I or an older sibling would—but we’re figuring it’s good Training Time, and that it’s better than nothing, and that he’ll improve with time. And as the days go by, we’re finding we keep thinking of more things we can add to the list at his ability level: “Use dustbuster for 5 minutes,” “Pick up 5 things that don’t belong in the dining room and put them away,” “Move the bathroom scale and trash can, and wash the floor underneath them.” We have him wash the kitchen floor with a wet washcloth, and it’s not thorough but it’s an improvement.
I work full-time while my husband works approx 5 hours a week, so he is responsible for most of the household chores (we don’t have kids so there is no childcare component). Even though he is willing to do all the housework, I prefer to have some responsibilities, if only for the reason Swistle gives, that it is better for me not to be lazy.
“there are other duties which take up a lot of time, like …, grocery shopping, cooking dinner, making breakfast and lunch also and clean up after those things…”
Everything else you listed is kosher, but those items up there..? People who work have to do them too.
I love this idea! I wish my kids were old enough, and I also wish that I remember this when they are! :-)
I know that people who work do those things too. I didn’t list everything I do all day, but in general, staying home with the children doesn’t mean I can do housework all day long. If I sent my child to daycare, I would hope the day care providers interact with my children and don’t ignore them so they can clean all day. And having the kids home means they are constantly making new messes all day long that I need to clean up, making it harder to get to everything else.
I am wasting more time I realize, but I am stewing over here. I think it is because I have always felt Swistle’s blog is a safe place to comment. I never see any negativity among her followers and this comment does not feel positive. It feels like it is meant to make me feel bad. While what you say may be true, the intention was not a good one. I wasn’t comparing working moms and stay at home moms in my comment. I was comparing myself to my husband. And all of those things I listed happen during HIS work day, and so even though he works, HE doesn’t do these things. I realize if both people work, someone still has to do these chores, but in my household, we have decided that I would do the grocery shopping and dinner making during working hours. So, there is no need to comment on what other people do. My questions pertained to my role in my family.
Yes, we do try to avoid bickering around here, especially on hot-button topics like the work/home debate. Let’s chalk this up to a misunderstanding, and if it goes any further south I’ll delete the conversation.
Deal :)
OMG – I think this might actually work. My next question – is there an app for that? I’ll give feedback later!!
Ha!
Truly enjoyed committed maintenance of your Sims dwelling.
I want to hug this entire post. My face broke into an uncontrolled grin at, “What I like best is GETTING CREDIT and having everyone see how many more points I have than they do.” Are there documents I need in order to begin this game? Download? What do the points eventually add up to reward-wise in your house? Or, is it just to see who can get the most points? I like winning, but, I might need to incentivize it for my kids.
I can’t believe I don’t remember when it’s been less than a week, but I don’t think I had to download anything. I just went to the website and opened an account. I made myself Dungeon Master, and after Paul signed up I made him a Henchling so that he too could add/edit tasks. The children are all Apprentices, so they can’t add or edit tasks. The first person who signs up has to send a link to the other people on the team. You also get to choose a team name, which is fun.
After that, you can choose to make your own task list or you can start with a pre-made list. I started with the pre-made and I’m glad I did: it was easy to delete/change the items that weren’t right, but the starter list gave me an idea of what they were talking about.
So far we haven’t tied the points or gold coins to anything tangible. We’re still thinking about that, though, because it seems like the thrill of doing this for the sheer competition of it may fade soon. Some households make gold coins worth actual money; others use them as Household Currency, like “Ten gold coins if I get my way on which TV show we watch!” or use them to buy video-game time.
I see, it’s a website! Oh, that is so much better than having something physical to keep track of . I would love to do this, but only one of my kids can read right now, but I think I could make it work w/ a real short list. Definitely need an incentive, but candy always works nicely here :) Thanks!
This is interesting. I was wondering the same thing as Matti — do they get something with their points? Does it translate to money or computer time or something?
It definitely CAN, and we’re thinking that over now. I’m feeling a little weary at the thought of Coming Up With a System—and yet it seems like it would be a very valuable (and perhaps essential) addition to the game. I was thinking the grown-ups could trade their gold coins for drinks, dinners out, who-has-to-take-the-kids-to-karate. Kids could maybe trade for actual cash, or for…I don’t know. Choice of TV show, extra video game time, staying up 15 minutes later, M&Ms, sitting in a particular seat in the car, not having to help clean up before dinner—that sort of thing. I just don’t want to set it up!
Could the kids and Paul set it up, and you just okay it? Maybe even make how much your vote counts dependent on how many points they have?
Sorry to post this on this comment… I just left a ton of info for you RE: reducing salt intake. I wasn’t sure if you check your older posts so thought I’d leave a comment here about it.
And all I know is IT IS CRAP that the woman gets blamed for a messy household when it is him and kids that create the largest messes. Instead of tripping over/kicking the same toy 10 times in a 30min period PICK IT UP!!! End of rant!
I need to do this when shoveling snow. It will beat the pity party I’ve currently been immersing myself in nearly every morning. (Jason goes to work super early every day, so it’s been left to me to handle all of our snow-removal opportunities, of which there have been several. Plus, our snowblower broke. Again. For the 4th time in less than 2 years. I had a little breakdown this morning, is what I’m saying.)
What should my “challenge” be? Right now, I try to beat my previous time, but since it takes me 90 minutes or so, that gets depressing: “Gee, this time it only took me 85 minutes! HAHAHHAHAHA. [sobs]”
I, too, am very motivated by winning or verbal praise. So this is so great. I dislike housework a lot, but I’m willing to do it sometimes and especially with others cleaning along side me. My husband doesn’t mind it, but he’s busy and it’s sporadic. BUT he LOVES chore charts (a holdover from his childhood) and responds well to that kind of thing. I think it’s a great idea in theory, but I don’t want to have to come up with it and maintain it, especially for my *husband*. Sheesh. I love this website (they should have an affiliate link for you!) because my husband will love it, and my little boys will think it’s cool, too. (They’re only 4 and 2 but the older one definitely understands video games).
This! Is! Brilliant!
This whole thing sound BRILLIANT. And I totally agree on the pronoun thing. It’s so aggravating! How in this modern day an age should my worth as a person (woman) be tied in any way to my enthusiasm for scrubbing baseboards? No one would ever expect my husband to care about doing it.
Just checking in to tell you that I clean like a stereotypical man, and it drives my husband batty, as he is the “woman” in that part of household-running.
I have now decided to never change, just to provide some solidarity for the Great Pronoun Switch of the 21st century! And also to stop feeling so bad about it because it is OUR house with messes made by OUR offspring. …And me.
Actually, upon reflection, I think this site could help me…
Wow, I’ve finally found another woman who admits to being the messier (aka more tolerant of clutter) one! Even more fitting is that my husband is unemployed (but calling it “retired,” since the kids are grown and moved out, but not officially collecting retirement yet), home all day, and willingly does pretty much all the household chores (except laundry, gardening, and grocery shopping) — while I work outside the home for a paid salary (home today, though, at my home office due to the snow, which he’s out snow-blowing — heehee). Before he was laid off, though, we were probably split 50-50 (ish); plus our last twenty-something was still at home, doing a lot of the chores in exchange for $0 towards room and board.
Husband is a bit OCD with respect to cleaning and certain things (the remote has to be placed just so, and I’m nagged when I leave things out); thus there are many things I cannot do well enough, so he HAS to do them himself (the martyr!), I find it all amusing and just try to roll with the punches (although the nagging is insulting and unpleasant).
I love collecting points for anything (yes, i totally do the Good Citizen Points thing in my head), but this household-chores-thing totally backfired for me and my ex-husband. We had a points-system for household chores, where collected points could be traded with the other person for an evening out or a weekend away (with the real bonus being a total of 1000 collected points = choosing destination country to immigrate to). Anyway, first he had a job and i didn’t, so i was racking up the points. Then i had a more than full-time job and he was unemployed, and yet i was still getting all the points. At a certain moment i just took down the list because it became too depressing to see my 523 points (even after several evenings out) against his 48 or so. He wanted to be seen as a feminist (or at least an ally), and apparently having a constant reminder of his incompetence in doing the practical work required to change current patriarchical reality depressed him rather than motivated him to do more.
(This book has probably been mentioned before, but a great read on the topic is “Kidding Ourselves: Breadwinning, Babies And Bargaining Power” by Rhona Mahony. Highly recommend it.)
This makes me think of my daughters and their hair. They hate for me to comb/do it and sometimes it is like a birds nest. I tell them no one is going to say, why don’t Maria and Veronica have their hair combed? They are going to say why doesn’t their mother DO something with that HAIR? Anyway I think your idea is genius! As usj.
YES. I tell Elizabeth: “No one is going to say, ‘Why would Elizabeth allow a gap of bare skin between capri leggings and socks in 4 degree weather?’—they will say, ‘Why would ELIZABETH’S MOTHER allow it?'”
Your children rush home to clean? Is there a prize at the end or something? Huh. I wonder if I could get my kids to buy into this.
There CAN be, and we’re working now on some sort of token-trade-in system—but right now the prize seems to be the joy of beating their siblings at something.
The MAIN REASON I wanted a Fitbit for Christmas is reading where Swistle said that if she forgot something in the basement, it just meant more Fitbit steps and what an attitude adjustment that was. So far, it’s working REALLY well for me. I don’t even check my steps very often but it totally changed my attitude – instead of frustration that I have to go downstairs AGAIN or make TWO trips to the car for groceries, I just think, “More Fitbit steps, YAY.” For me, that alone has been totally worth it.
I watched a lady at the grocery store (older than me but younger than my mom, so definitely a grown-up) push her cart across the parking lot up to the sidewalk outside the door and … just leave it. She walked farther than if she’d put it in a cart corral but didn’t bother to finish the job and put it away. I was staring with my mouth hanging open because I was so surprised at her chutzpah. Then I earned some extra Good Citizen Points and grabbed her cart as I walked by.
hmm. i loved that book and i remember being intrigued by chore wars – i wonder if my kid is old enough to get into it.
that said, i am definitely the slovenly housekeeper in my house. my husband is much tidier. however, i am MUCH better at loading the dishwasher.