We are trying to figure out what to do about the kids and musical instruments. Instruments seem to fall into a category like diets and psychiatric medicine: there never seems to be a point where everyone agrees it’s not working and you can give up. Instead, it’s “He just hasn’t found the right one for him!” and “He just needs to give it more time!”
William first tried clarinet, since he didn’t really care what he tried first and we already had the clarinet Rob chose at that age. It sounded terrible all year, making me re-regret not making Rob keep going with it awhile longer, since Rob made it sound pretty within a week of practicing BUT OH WELL BYGONES. William said he didn’t mind instruments per se, but that the clarinet was not right for him: he didn’t like the sound of it (ORLY??).
So this year he tried trumpet. It’s been “like clarinet, but louder.” After his band concert last week, I asked if his teacher had given the class any feedback on the performance. He said yes, and that she’d had a video of it for them to see. He said, “Unfortunately, the video was really bad quality”—and I said, “Er, I’m not sure that was the fault of the…” just as he said “NO, NOT BECAUSE OF THAT. IT WAS STATIC ON THE RECORDING.” Well. I’m just saying.
Playing an instrument is such a well-rounded thing to do. And I like the idea of them being in band. (Yes, I’ve seen that article!) And it seems like it would be very nice on a college application. But when do we say “This is not only a constant struggle but also a constant torment. He is just Not Musical. Music is just Not His Thing, and that is Just Fine”? Not everyone does art; not everyone dances; not everyone builds furniture; not everyone likes camping; not everyone does well with math; not everyone picks up foreign languages; not everyone has a feel for motors and engines. It seems like music actually falls into THAT category instead: things some people have an aptitude for, and others don’t. We all think our own specialties are crucial for human fulfillment—but we can’t all do everything.
Now Rob is giving it a second shot. He’s starting high school this year, and the school requires a year of either music or art, and he’d prefer music. I tried to persuade him to go back to clarinet (we ENJOYED hearing him practice! ENJOYED it!), but he says it just isn’t his style. So he’s trying keyboard/piano, and we’re going to get him lessons all this summer so he has at least SOME experience before he starts—and also so that if it’s a total bust, maybe there will be time to switch to chorus or art instead.
One thing we’re considering is getting William piano/keyboard lessons TOO. This could perhaps cause some healthy competition. Or it could backfire and make the one who doesn’t do as well give up.
I am of two minds about instruments. Firstly, I have no musical talent. None. If I want to clap along with the rhythm in church, my husband has to pat my leg in time with the music or I cannot do it. I am not exaggerating in the least. Also, when we used to watch the early episodes of American Idol, I would ask Matt “is this one of the really good people or the really bad ones?” because I honestly couldn’t tell. (Well, if they were trying. If they were being terrible on purpose to get on TV I could tell.)
But! I wish I had had something I did when I was growing up. The thing to answer when people asked you what your interests are. The thing to fill in on those college applications. (I was a reader. And when you are little, no one thinks that that counts.) I did play piano for a little while (I had to learn it like I learned math and such and I suspect I wasn’t very good) and I did drama and gymnastics but I was never good enough at any of them to have it count as a talent. I want my children to have a talent. I don’t care what it is, but I want them to be able to do something that you can put in a talent show. And music is a really good way to get a talent.
My son started with drums and everyone exclaimed – you are crazy – drums!?! And yes – sometimes it’s loud, but it’s never atonal and/or discordant. And when he picked up trumpet, as well, I discovered how lucky we were when he was only doing drums. Oh the pain. Even when he started playing well, it was so much more of a disruption than drums.
Hmmm. Tough call. You know that I think music training is second only to toilet training in importance (okay, and reading), but unless they really love music, starting an instrument in high school can be pretty daunting. I think I might stick with vocal music in that case–they’ll still learn how to read music, and they’ll make music more quickly. Plus, if you’re going for resume activities, it’s easier to stick with this one. What’s William’s take on this?
He’s somewhat discouraged (two years of instruments and hated both years), but willing to keep trying. Both boys say they’d rather do instruments than sing.
Yeah, all of my boys feel the same way.
FWIW, although one often misses out on the school participation aspect of playing an instrument (since school bands and orchestras may not have piano parts for a lot of their music and/or a teacher often plays and/or there is often only one piano player, as opposed to a jillion clarinets), I think the piano is BY FAR the best choice to start with learning music. The actual “having a reasonable piano on which to practice” is a HUGE obstacle for some, of course. But IMO you get the most musical bang for your buck when you play piano – the theory, the way chords are put together, the manual dexterity, etc. etc. HOWEVER, I am a musical person from a musical family and we have all been very motivated to be musical in some way, so that is surely coloring my feelings here.
I think it’s huge that William is still willing to continue with music, so I wouldn’t feel guilt about “making” him continue. But 1) from what I’ve read on your blog, it seems like he is a laid-back sort of kid anyway so he might have to be super miserable to really speak up about it? and 2) not everyone is going to be a musician. ;) I’d say, give it one more shot and then give him the option to look for a different extra-curricular activity. I agree with the other posters who’ve mentioned percussion as an option — there are lots of different ways to go there, if the “reading the music” and “having a sense of rhythm” parts have not been the issues.
As someone who thinks music is incredibly important, I also think it can be problematic if kids have, say, bad teachers who make them dislike it (my choir teacher in HS was like this, so I quit senior year and then went to college and got into the highest auditioned choir with an amazing director, so it was very clearly a not-me-it-was-him thing). I mean I’m starting my kids on piano very young and keeping them with a teacher who is incredibly positive and committed to their having fun even though it means a pain in the ass drive once a week. So I guess my perspective is that it’s almost all down to the teacher, not necessarily the instrument. That said, they might have a STYLE of music that one would enjoy more than others. Perhaps instead of putting both of them in piano, would one enjoy classical guitar instead? Or even jazz lessons, or something else that is not what the other one is doing. If they truly don’t like it, that’s their perogative, certainly. but I’ll admit based on my experience and my friends who’ve done music pedagogy, it really seems like the kids who don’t like it have a personality conflict with the teacher. The OTHER thing I’ll say (sorry for the novel) is that practicing can be a huge butting-heads terrible conflict between kids and parents. The most amazing thing I’ve ever read on this subject was this book (which is kinda hard to find, hence my linking to abebooks and not amazon) http://www.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?isbn=9780976785439&n=100121503¶trk=&cm_sp=plp-_-9780976785439-_-used It’s a shortish book and is new from sharmusic.com for $23 so it might not be worth it to you but it is a REALLY eye-opening book with ideas for games and such. It’s aimed toward violin parents but works really well for us with piano perspectives as well.
I never grew up playing an instrument and have always wanted to learn the piano. As an adult, I took up taiko and it’s super fun! I did my first workshop at San Jose Taiko (CA) while on holiday in USA then came back to Australia and found regular classes. I don’t need to read typical music to play it but there is a Japanese written form to the music. If they dont like music as teens, they may as adults!
I love reading about this! I will check back to see more comments!
I feel like I am failing my children by not passing on any musical talent/aptitude or foreign language talent/aptitude. Both seem so valuable! Character-enriching! And yet, neither my husband nor I have any abilities in those areas at all and both would be so much easier to pass along when it already happens in your home (ie one of you speaks a foreign language/plays piano so they learn it naturally by watching and listening to you.)
So I read to my kids and my husband takes them in the garage and builds stuff out of wood scraps with them and that’s it. That’s what they get from us. Sorry kids!
That said, if one of them is interested in learning an instrument, we will do our tone-deaf best to help them!
As others have said, piano is actually an excellent starter instrument. Unlike many instruments, if you hit the key, you get a real note – no inbetweens/out of tune notes possible. The other thing, if at all possible, is to have them have a dream or a vision of what they hope they could do with music (an advanced piece they aspire to playing, or the vision of wooing girls with cool songs on the guitar, or … etc). A dream like that can offer them the kind of internal motivation that “you really ought to learn this” can’t do.
Good luck.
I’ll preface this by saying I am not musical at all and hated struggling with learning an instrument and never feeling like I got good at it so I have a biased toward letting a kid quit if they want to. But if said kid is game to keep going, then maybe there is value in the learning of persistance and the value of sticking with things even if they don’t come easily.
I do want to add that there is very little college application value to being in a band/playing an instrument unless the applicant is so good that they are also sending in tapes and auditioning as a major. Other than that, band is just another activity and activities don’t matter for 99% of college applicants so kids should just do what they enjoy, for the sake of enjoying it.
I was in band in both middle school and high school. I wasn’t the best but wasn’t the worst either. Now I appreciate being exposed to many types of music, and really love hearing an obscure classical piece we played in band on a car commercial. Or hearing some 70s hits we did in marching band on the oldies station.
This comment probably doesn’t completely go with what you were asking, but I think it might help them “get more interested” if there is a real spark in them. One thing that might help is having them find a (sorry I can’t think of a better term) “musical hero” in their instrument’s field. So if they like jazz, buy them some jazz albums to listen to by their hero, books to read up on, and if their hero is alive maybe a promise of tickets to a show. Many modern bands have all kinds of musicians, so they may really like the drummer from X band, or whatever. Trumpet/brass playing kids might like seeing drum corps in person (usually a cheap show, all the kids would probably like it too, as the music is very good.)
OK, I have many thoughts about this that I will try to present in some kind of order.
I have been a musician (singing in choirs) for most of my life; I started in about 4th grade not because I wanted to, but because my mom made me. She insisted that I needed to get out of the house and would love it, and it turned out she was right, and choir is an important and crucial part of my life today, almost 30 years later. I also dinked around with violin (my choice) from 5th-8th grade but it never grabbed me the way choir did. So I do think that trying different instruments is a good idea. [I will also point out here that choir has the added advantage of being essentially free, as you are already equipped with your instrument. although you might have to buy costumes/uniforms.] It is my personal belief that performing music with a group gives you a lot of really valuable skills beyond musicianship, similar to playing team sports.
I think that you cannot force a kid to enjoy music–like any other skill/interest, some people’s brains just don’t work that way–but school band (or choir! but you say they don’t want to sing) is a perfect opportunity to try out different kinds of instruments and figure out if you want to go further into music. However, if their enjoyment is going to be measured by the quality of performing…school band is not a good metric for that. Because, let’s face it, most school bands/orchestras are not that great, and the kids don’t get the individual instruction they need to become good at the instruments they’re playing.
Which brings me to my next thought, which is if William still likes trumpet or clarinet, would you consider getting him private lessons in either of those things? You mention getting Rob piano lessons and maybe William, but you don’t say whether W is actually INTERESTED in piano. I think the best way to torpedo any budding musical interest is to make a kid play something they’re not interested in playing. I also wonder if they would be interested in being in theater or a musical–does your town have summer programs?
In the end, as you say, not everyone is a musician. My husband and I would love for our daughter to take music and have it be important to her the way it’s important to us. But I think it’s more important that kids have SOMETHING, not necessarily music. Maybe it’s soccer. Maybe it’s debate. Maybe it’s drama. But something they can hang their hat on and say “I’m a part of this.”
(One more vote for choir! Choir!)
Oh! Yes, I should have said that piano/keyboard is William’s next pick. He had no pick the first time and thought clarinet seemed like the best choice of those available, but then he hated it. The next time, he chose, and he chose trumpet, but then he hated that too. His next choice is keyboard/piano, but I’m wondering if I should bother. The lessons are so expensive if it turns out to be yet another thing he hates.
I suggest using headphones and listening to white noise (or brown/pink noise) from http://www.simplynoise.com. I have used it to drown out the worst, worst, WORST stuff before.
I feel like it takes longer to learn how to make brass instruments sound pretty than woodwinds. With woodwinds, once you have the basic blowing technique down, different fingerings relate directly to different notes. On brass instruments, there are a limited number of fingerings/valves and the rest depends on controlling lip and breath movement. It’s more complicated–you have to buzz your lips at very specific speeds to get the right note, which is something that doesn’t apply in woodwinds.
I did music and band and loved it. Even though I don’t do it now, it helped me appreciate a wide range of music types, learn about team work, etc. If he’s not disheartened, is learning things, and enjoys it, I’d chalk it up to a valuable experience, regardless of whether or not he has a “natural” musical tendency.
If Rob had talent at the clarinet, how about saxophone? Does he like the sound of one instrument more than the sound of others? The band director might be a help (unless they really, really need a french horn).
Someone told me that playing the piano is the best thing for improving mathematical ability – something about doing 2 different things with your hands at the same time, or whatever. My mother’s take on piano lessons is that when you’re 70 (she’s 90), you’re probably not going to be doing gymnastics or playing soccer or whatnot anymore, but you can still sit down at the piano and entertain yourself (and she does).
UUUUGGGGHHHHHH I hated having to play an instrument. Piano! Cello! Clarinet! I have nothing but horrible memories of all of it. I can sing – quite well, actually, and did musical theater throughout all of high school, plus church and school choir and REALLY LIKED it, but do not – DO NOT- have the dexterity or inclination for actual non-voice box instruments) As a consequence, I almost cannot imagine having a child who plays an instrument unless they specifically ASK for it, but I also know apparently I’m suppose to provide EXPOSURE and FUCK MAN it just all seems like SUCH A HASSLE (hi, Liz, welcome to parenting).
I think there is always an element of “what if my kid IS really good at ONE FLAVOR of this ONE THING and we just keep having to work on it till we find it, and not let him be all “no, I hate it, I suck, let’s stop”, but … I dunno. I could have been a really good athlete – certainly, I am one as an adult, but I didn’t care to do sports as a kid. Hated all teams, quit everything early. We tried THIS sport and then THAT sport in search of the elusive One that would be My Thing. But, I didn’t WANT to do any of them and I feel like the Not Wanting To is as important as the Innate Ability portion of this game. A lot of people COULD BE great at a type of job, but they have to also WANT TO do the work, ya know? If your kid sucks at music, and doesn’t enjoy it anyway, save everyone the hassle and just stop. That will free up time for stuff they DO want to do. I mean, sure, being on sports teams has a lot of benefits, but i didn’t want to do that, and as a consequence I had a lot of time to be in choir, and on the lit mag, and do theater program, which were ALSO beneficial, and then when I figured out i DO like sports as an adult, well, that was just a nice little bonus.
Sorry. This is bringing up lots of Feelings for me, as I vividly remember feeling like there was something wrong with me as a kid – why couldn’t I have a sport or an instrument, was I doomed to be mediocre at everything, always? But I found my thing, eventually, and that made all the difference. And I can say having me stick with those things that were not My Thing (sports, band) would not have helped me find My Thing quicker.
I played flute from grades 4-12. I was competent, but not extraordinary. But I enjoyed it, and now that my son is old enough to try band, I will let him continue as long as he has an interest. He played trumpet this year, but is thinking of switching to clarinet next year (mostly, I think, because the case is smaller and will be easier to take on the bus). He can dabble and try a different instrument each year for all I care: I am thrilled that he is willing to give it a try. I think learning an instrument is great for all sorts of things, from learning fractions to self-discipline. So, I say, if your sons show any interest, and you can afford it, let them do it. They may not be virtuosi, but if they are enjoying it enough to continue, the benefits are fabulous. Just bring seat cushions for the band concerts, for they be long and often painful…
I found this post so interesting as I am not a parent yet and I was extremely musical as a child so I never would have thought of this question. Kids learn recorder in 3rd grade and then at 5th grace can ‘choose’ an instrument through school. By this time, no one encouraged me to do this, I had found my father’s clarinet in the attic and basically…taught myself to play. Since then I picked up several other instruments in a similar way ans it was really integral to my growing up. BUT I think this was purely because it was self driven. I begged parents for instruments. For lessons. To go to band camps in the summer. (Oh I was such a cool kid…) I really think that unless they WANT to keep trying/playing, why keep it up? Maybe they’ll love singing more, or something else? It was something that kept me out of trouble and kept me active ans social and a bit disciplined. Maybe they will find some other activity that will give them the same?
That said, hdoes your music teacher do private lessons? Maybe worth a shot if you haven’t asked. When I was learning another instrument, I got a few private lessons that I remember being far cheaper because they were in school by the teacher. Maybe an option if available since they can be so expensive!
My youngest started piano lessons last year. I wanted him to start with piano, for all the reasons someone mentioned already, and he was willing to since we found a teacher he loved — the older sister of my daughter’s friend. The lessons were cheaper than a traditional piano school/instructor, and he enjoyed the lessons and learned so much. This girl is an accomplished pianist, and is at college to do so for a career, so she knows her stuff. All this is to say that I think piano is an awesome choice, and yes, lessons are $$$ but maybe you can find a high school student who would like to make some money once a week teaching your son. If it doesn’t work out after a few months, not a big loss. Good luck!
I find this interesting in the larger context of when we should push our kids to continue on with things and when we should let them quit which I think you’ve posted about too? I’ve come to the conclusion that it is a bit of a crap shoot though and really hard to predict. Depends on the child’s temperment but also many things in the future which cannot be predicted. My parents pushed me to take piano lessons for about 5 years. I hated every minute. I was not musical, had no interest and it was a struggle to force me to practice. I think it actually hurt my self-esteem too in that I was horrible and felt shame around that! My parents had this belief that it would enrich my life in the future if they pushed me. They were wrong. But on the other hand, there are things that they pushed me on when I wanted to quit which did enrich my life in the future and I understand their intentions. That being said, it doesn’t sound like William is begging to stop or hating it the way that I was and clearly, as I can read in the comments, playing music does enrich the lives of many so maybe it’s worth a try to keep him in it as long as he is showing some interest?
And on the other, other hand, it does not sound like he is exhibiting great musicality so perhaps there are better places to invest your resources for him as you’ve pointed out. I agree with you that not everyone has to be a musician (obviously I agree since it’s not part of my life!) I find it interesting though that my parents put me in so many activities when I was younger and the things that I do now for fun and pleasure and that I am good at (reading, distance running, rock climbing/hiking) are all things I discovered as an adult and not due to what they exposed me to as a child (or perhaps despite what they exposed me to?) Not sure where I am going with all of this except that it’s hard to know as parents where to invest our resources for our kids and how hard to push…
I think I am one of the very few people I know who had to beg their parents to let them play an instrument. I hassled my parents to get me piano lessons for a year when I was 7. They finally relented when I was 8 and I played for 10 years. I only stopped when I went to college and got involved in other things. It was such a great experience for me though and I never regret learning to read music or the time I spent learning pieces I can no longer even hope to play ;-)
Oldest, on the other hand, has shown no interest in playing an instrument at all and I’m not inclined to force the issue because we are already so busy with his other activities. Plus, the thought of fighting with him nightly to practice makes me want to lie down and die. I feel like my family is already at maximum capacity with the time and money commitment of soccer and swimming. If oldest (or youngest when she gets old enough) begged me to play an instrument, I would get him lessons because I’m all for kid-led passions. But, barring that, I’m not up to the emotional, time, or monetary battle forcing oldest to take an instrument would require.
As you know, I played piano for a couple of years and then quit. Although I have a bit of lasting regret as an adult, it was such a battle at home that I think my parents were wise to let me stop. (as an aside, I guess if I had that much regret, I would’ve learned as an adult…)
So far, my daughter does not play an instrument. She is VERY into ballet and has reached the level where she goes a few times a week for longer and longer periods of time. She chose not to join 5th grade band, because her dancing is very important to her. She is talented (I’m biased, but she is) and she has invested a lot of time into it (and we have invested a lot of money…) so we are willing to have that be her focus.
My son is too young being in first grade. He has many instruments (drums, electric guitar, guitar) to “rock out with”.
My grandmother insisted that I take piano lessons as a child, and since my mother regretted having no musical ability whatsoever, she readily agreed. I’ve always loved music but absolutely HATED piano lessons. I did well, but piano just wasn’t for me. In middle school we had to learn recorder, which was fine but boring and in high school I attempted violin, but again, that just wasn’t for me. I did however have excellent theory and music reading ability from the piano lessons I took in elementary school, so I would definitely recommend piano to anyone looking to advance any musical talent they have.
In late middle school I got into percussion, which I would highly recommend to any child that gets bored with one instrument. Percussion isn’t only about drums. While there is an extremely vast selection of drums (outside of a drum set), a lot of school bands also have xylophones, marimbas, vibraphones, cymbals, bells, and many, many more. This struck my interest because if I got bored of practicing my snare drum rhythms and techniques, I could move to something more melodic.
I’ve been teaching kids percussion for the past 5 years now, and it’s definitely an excellent choice for anyone that likes to move around and not be limited to one instrument for their entire school career.
My daughter took piano lessons for three years in school and liked playing, but hated practicing. She is going into Middle School next year and has the option of band, chorus, or visual arts. At first, I was pretty sure I wanted her to do band, since I did it and enjoyed it enough. But, when we registered she asked if she could do visual arts instead because “I don’t really like practicing” and she IS very good at art. I decided that that was okay, since I’m not very good at making her practice the way my mom made me.
I’ve read most of the comments and people bring up very good points. I’m partway through my Bachelor of Music right now, so I’m obviously very pro-music as a thing. However, my parents let me quit piano lessons when I was 11 (I started at six, I think) after my piano teacher moved away and I was too scared to find a new one and also not very interested. I wound up getting most of my musical experience through choir, and now my main “instrument” at school is voice.
In general, I think piano is a great idea to try because it’s a very visual instrument with a direct correlation between what you see and where you put your hand and what note comes out – quite a different experience than a wind instrument. Also, you can play more than one note at once! Which is fun and another major difference from clarinet or trumpet. And if there’s not very much interest after a year, then you tried.
Oh, and I don’t know if it’s an option since you mention band, but guitar is really fun. I just took a beginner classical guitar class this year and I had a blast! It was a completely different way of learning to play an instrument than either voice, saxophone, or piano (which are the ones I’ve done).
My parents also let me give up dance when I was nine or ten, and I’m grateful that they did. Now I am interested in both dance and piano, and am considering taking lessons or classes to get better at them, but I would have been miserable trying to do them seriously as a youngster.
Basically – good luck! I hope you find options that are doable for you and the kids! (Also, hi, I am new to reading your blog!)
I don’t have a musical bone in my body. Sometimes when I say that Musical Types say that everyone is musical, to which I say, ha! I can’t hear music properly–like if it sounds horrible I won’t hear that–and I really cannot sing. So when in middle school one had to be in chorus or band I did both–and no, I don’t know why I did both–and although I think I could play Hot Cross Buns on the clarinet for the most part I just ran my fingers up and down the keys. Keyholes. Those little holes.
Oh P.S. I took piano as a kid briefly. Then when i was eight my piano teacher told me she’d overheard me talking to my mom and I’d been a real asshole, adn that was in the end of that.
I’m going to have come back and read the comments later, but I just wanted to agree with you (I think we agree?) that although learning an instrument is a worthy goal and has all sorts of benefits that I don’t dispute it isn’t some kind of superior life skill high, high above an assortment of other life skills. The way some people approach it you’d think that knowing music is critical to living a moral life. Musical aptitude = VERY VERY GOOD, but not ESSENTIAL to a fulfilling life.
{sigh} I just… Okay, I think that music has a huge value with children. I think it helps them to learn other things like math and I think that too many places are cutting it out of the curriculum. That being said, neither my husband nor I are musical. We can’t read music, we don’t know if what we’re hearing is bad or good, and with all the things there are for kids to learn and enjoy, I had to ask myself if I wanted to be having the “Did you practice?” argument everyday on top of the running around for sports and electives and ensuring they got good grades. Something had to give, or rather something had to not be encouraged I guess. So I never really pushed it with either kid. It just so happens that both of my kids were given the opportunity to try instruments that couldn’t go home with them ;) and I happily signed the permission slips for those. My son tried playing bass in 5th grade and within 6 weeks hated it and wanted out out out. I didn’t argue. I’m usually a “finish what you start” type of parent, but I didn’t have it in me to push this one. My daughter had the opportunity in 4th grade to try out for choir chimes at school and was accepted and has had two concerts which were DELIGHTFUL. I actually enjoyed attending and listening.
So, pick your battles. How hard do you want to make this on yourself and the kiddos? If an instrument must be played – I heartily recommend choir chimes.
Having said ALL OF THAT – I have always wished to be able to play the piano just not enough to do anything about it.
I can’t offer much help with band things, since my eldest daughter played the Cello, and I was pleasantly surprised that unlike most instruments, it sounded really good after not that long. It helped that her school has an amazing orchestra program, and the director is a master cellist. I don’t recommend the healthy competition either, it never seems to end well.